Oil Painting

Post examples...
Of framing styles or techniques that rocked your boat, and also of those that didn't
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Johnny9
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Oil Painting

Post by Johnny9 »

Guys,

After a little help again....

I am really quite new to framing, I've had a few lessons now & am quite confident on framing prints & photo's etc, but I still have lots to learn, this is hopefully where you come in....
I've been asked to frame an Oil Painting, listed below are the materials I was going to use, I'm just after confirmation or putting straight on if I'm using the right materials or not....

Moulding

2mm Float Glass

Conservation Mount Board

Ph Netrual Conservation fixing Tape

Art-Bak Conservation Backboard.

Pleasee reply & let me know if this is Satisfactory or I need to change some materials for an oil Painting...

Many Thanks johnny9
Roboframer

Post by Roboframer »

Is it on paper, board or canvas and is the paint 'lumpy' or quite smooth?
Alzibiff
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Post by Alzibiff »

Oil painting
Normally not glazed so ditch the 2mm glass.
No mention of stretcher bars.
Will let the other members point you in a better direction but s-t-e-a-d-y - don't run before starting to walk. Take it all very easy and do some research.

Alan
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Post by Moglet »

Hi Johnny!
Alzibiff wrote:Oil painting.... Normally not glazed...
Fwiw, normally it's not necessary to glaze the frame for an oil painting, or indeed for an acrylic, because they are usually varnished. The varnish therefore, protects the painted surface in the way that glass protects a mounted print, for example.

If the customer is the artist, and an oil is being framed, it is always worth asking how long it has been finished (oils need time to dry properly before they are framed). Time to dry may vary, based on the thickness of the paint, and also the type of oil paints used. Also it is worth checking with the artist that the work has, in fact, been varnished. I find it not uncommon for hobby artists who are learning to paint not to realise that their work should be varnished prior to framing.

If the customer who has brought the oil in for framing is not the artist, and is not sure of how long the piece has been painted, it's worth checking to see if the artist has put the finish date on the work (either beside their signature, or sometimes on the back of the work).
........Áine JGF SGF FTB
Image .Briseann an dúchas trí shuiligh an chuit.
markw

Post by markw »

Robo's reply is the best so far - we need to know a few more details - Canvas? Board? is it stretched - does it need stretchers etc etc.
fineedge
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Post by fineedge »

No matter what the ground is - paper, board canvas etc - I think the paint gives off an oily fume for a long time after it is thought to be dry and this then sits as a fatty residue or haze on the inside of the glass which then interferes with the integrity of the artwork
Alan
Roboframer

Post by Roboframer »

fineedge wrote:No matter what the ground is - paper, board canvas etc - I think the paint gives off an oily fume for a long time after it is thought to be dry and this then sits as a fatty residue or haze on the inside of the glass which then interferes with the integrity of the artwork
This can happen on giclees on canvas that have been varnished and/or hand embellished.

It can and does happen on fabrics and it can and does happen on stuff that you have framed with wet adhesive still not fully gone off - like PVA on slips.

If it's on paper, varnished or not, it should have glass IMHO - and it could have whatever it's on. Not that Johnny will want to go there.

Think about it - (They have in the States) OK - it's varnished - but you can't just rub a damp cloth over it can you!

Basic cleaning even is not for the daily (OK weekly) housework - not even spring cleaning - look at the reframing jobs you get - you'd rather trash the glass than try and clean it it's so minging - well that ming is on the varnish of an oil - and there are nooks and crannies where there is even more accumulated ming!

Now we are talking about the services of a restorer - or maybe a clever framer.

Take it a few stages further and we are indeed talking restoration - as in removal and replacemenmt of varnish.

Why not glaze oils? Seal them in too?

OK - you may get some outgassing - will it affect the oil - or just the glass, which can be removed, wiped and replaced.

"Oh - but glass will spoil the ........"

Museum glass won't missus!

Done quite a few.

Anyway - back to this oil in hand - what's it like then?
Roboframer

Post by Roboframer »

Roboframer wrote: This can happen on giclees on canvas and 'canvas board' that have been varnished and/or hand embellished.

It can and does happen on fabrics and it can and does happen on stuff that you have framed with wet adhesive still not fully gone off - like PVA on slips.

If it's on paper, varnished or not, it should have glass IMHO - and it could have whatever it's on. Not that Johnny will want to go there.

Think about it - (They have in the States) OK - it's varnished - but you can't just rub a damp cloth over it can you!

Basic cleaning even is not for the daily (OK weekly) housework - not even spring cleaning - look at the reframing jobs you get - you'd rather trash the glass than try and clean it it's so minging - well that ming is on the varnish of an oil - and there are nooks and crannies where there is even more accumulated ming!

Now we are talking about the services of a restorer - or maybe a clever framer.

Take it a few stages further and we are indeed talking restoration - as in removal and replacemenmt of varnish.

Why not glaze oils? Seal them in too?

OK - you may get some outgassing - will it affect the oil - or just the glass, which can be removed, wiped and replaced.

"Oh - but glass will spoil the ........"

Museum glass won't missus!

Done quite a few.

Anyway - back to this oil in hand - what's it like then?
Roboframer

Post by Roboframer »

Sorry about that double post.
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Post by Spit »

Flumblefingers. :lol:
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fineedge
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Post by fineedge »

Agree totally John. I do glaze oils on paper or card but just warn the customer what could happen and to bring it in for cleaning or replacing down the line ( once reframed a woodcut which was initially printed with a very oily ink and the image was actually imprinted/etched into the glass )
Alan
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prospero
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Post by prospero »

To my mind, it is the artist's job to do the varnishing. Never varnish a painting without the artist's permission. I will do it if asked, but idealy the painting should be at least six months old. If you varnish too soon the varnish will bond permanently with the paint and can never be stripped off.
Oils dry by chemical reaction. They keep on 'drying' for about 100 years.
This is also why they need to breathe, so glass is not desirable. The only time I would glaze an oil is if it were on paper. Works like this tend to be preiminary sketches and the like.

Generally oils are easier to frame as just have to make a frame and wack it in. :wink: No glass/mounts/etc. But there are few a points to be considered. If the painting is on stretcher bars (most are) then the edges can be less than neat so you have to work out exactly where the visible area starts. Some artist-stretched canvases can be waaaay out of square.
The chosen moulding will need a wider lip on the rebate then for glazed pics. Stretched canvases need plenty of elbow room. They should never fit
too snugly in the frame. Canvases can go slack with time and a biggish one can grow a lot if you have to tap the wedges in a bit to restore the tension. They should be only tight enough so that they don't flap about. The term 'stretching' is misleading. You want to avoid stretching.

A fav method of fixing the canvas into the frame are 'Z' clips which are flexible coppery strips with a sharp point on each end. Personally I would never use them. OK, they do the job but they a PITA and I don't like the idea of hammering into the stretcher. I often see canvases nailed into a frame which is even worse. I like to use spring clips screwed into the frame. They are very strong and the painting can easily be removed.

I also dislike the practice of 'sealing' the back of framed oils with tape. It serves no useful purpose and is a pain to remove. Sometimes I am asked to add a backing board to an oil. This isn't as silly as it sounds as oils are vunerable to prods and such. Corrugated board is OK, but do cut a few ventilation holes in it. :P
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Post by Moglet »

I have glazed the occasional oil on canvas, but for very particular reasons:

First occasion was under protest, where an artist was having an exhibition and insisted on putting work into the show that had only been painted in the last couple of weeks, including a couple of works with very heavy impasto... :roll: (I hasten to add that the exhibition was not held at my premises: I don't think he was being very considerate toward his customers. For right or wrong, I would not have felt comfortable offering paintings for sale in that condition). I elected to glaze them, because at least it would stop people from sticking their fingers into the wet paint while they were on show.

Second occasion was on a damaged L S Lowry original - it was torn in a couple of places, and ready to go the same way in a couple of others. (Customer elected not to send the piece to a conservator, by the way.)

On both occasions I used a scoop on the stretched canvasses, glass on top of the scoop and a cap moulding to hold the glass in place.

Could I have adopted better methods, given the above circumstances? :?:
........Áine JGF SGF FTB
Image .Briseann an dúchas trí shuiligh an chuit.
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prospero
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Post by prospero »

There is always the exception. :wink:

Some priceless paintings in public galleries have bulletproof glass. :P

On a fragile old painting glass has an unexpecting bonus in saving any paint flakes that may come off.
Paul Hardy

Re: Oil Painting

Post by Paul Hardy »

Johnny9 wrote: 2mm Float Glass

Conservation Mount Board

Ph Netrual Conservation fixing Tape

Art-Bak Conservation Backboard.
Do you intend to put a mount on the oil painting?

Paul Hardy
www.sudbury-picture-frames.co.uk
Johnny9
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Post by Johnny9 »

WOW!!!!

Thanks for All your replies, I do not have the work in hand yet, but I will have soon, I didn't realise their was so much to think about, I am very glad I contacted you guys first.....
I will get the piece of work, inspect it & get back to you..... :)

Thanks again for your replies....

Johnny
beth
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Post by beth »

I agree z = PITA, i use anvas offsets from lion page 114, artist like the can easily remove their paintings :)
Moglet
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Post by Moglet »

beth wrote:I use canvas offsets from Lion ....
Me too. Great yokes! :)
........Áine JGF SGF FTB
Image .Briseann an dúchas trí shuiligh an chuit.
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