CMC work bench!!

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Whitewater Gallery
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CMC work bench!!

Post by Whitewater Gallery »

I am seriously looking at investing in a CMC mount cutter but, as most framers are I am sure, am tight for space. We only produce up to about 10 mounts a day so I was wondering if a flat bed machine can also be used as a work area on which we would also fix prints in the mounts and wrap them in the cellophane? If this is not out of the question we can loose a bench and gain a cutter as I will still have one bench for glass cutting, one for underpinning and another for final assembly.

Also is there an event this year where all 4 main manufacturers will be under the one roof? If I have to I might have to wait till the spring fair but that said I can not see any of them listed as exhibiting on the show website.

Any feedback would be gratefully appreciated.

Thanks

Nick
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by grahamdown »

Hi,

You could always wall mount the CMC?

Regards,

Graham
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Whitewater Gallery »

Thanks Graham, I had thought about that, but my thinking is that if I can use the CMC bed as a light duty bench to put prints in the mounts I am, with my current setup, gaining a bench.
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IFGL
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by IFGL »

the split second our cmc stops moving someone starts fitting pictures into mounts on it.
Roboframer

Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Roboframer »

Mine's not flat as in horizontal, it's ..... I'm not sure what it is, somewhere between 30-45 degrees but it's big, it's mine and I don't have a problem using it for whatever else I can, but that would mostly be hinging the undermount to the window mount on larger things, especially when the 'proper' place to do that is spoken for.

Hinging/otherwise mounting artwork is mostly not on as you can't let go of it, it'll slide down the slope and the above can be tricky too.

I've got a huge (not as huge as my CMC bed, admittedly) old counterweighted draughtsman's table at home that will pivot between horizontal-vertical with a foot brake - how useful would that be on a CMC!
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by prospero »

Haven't got a CMC, but I do have a vac press which I sometimes go weeks or months without using. I built it into a bench so that the bench top flips up to use the press. When finished mounting the top drops down and it's a handy bench again.
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Whitewater Gallery
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Whitewater Gallery »

Now that opens up a whole world of possibilities, I have a heat press on the wish list but had not thought of storing it in the bench! More wandering round the room with a measuring tape for me!!
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Otters Pool Studio »

My more immediate concern would be justifying the cost of a CMC if you are only producing up to 10 mounts a day. For me, the monthly rental cost of my Gunnar divided by the number of working days comes out at about £20 per day. If this was you, it would be costing you an additional £2 to produce each mount.

Whilst your costs/working hours/etc, will undoubtedly be different to mine, it is a critical calculation to consider.
Jon.
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prospero
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by prospero »

CMCs are marvellous machines and invaluable for cutting weird shaped openings - letters, etc. But if you cut mainly bog-standard rectangles they can be a bit of an indulgence. Unless you do high volume repeat production work.

The trap is that once you have the beast you will be tempted to get your moneys worth by doing fancy cuts that really aren't essential to your business. You might find yourself pushing fancy mounts that people just don't want.
A lot of the mind-boggling CMC-cut mounts that you see are done to sell CMCs. If you are only doing 10 or so mounts per day I would think carefully about it.
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Whitewater Gallery »

Otters Pool Studio wrote:For me, the monthly rental cost of my Gunnar divided by the number of working days comes out at about £20 per day. If this was you, it would be costing you an additional £2 to produce each mount.

Whilst your costs/working hours/etc, will undoubtedly be different to mine, it is a critical calculation to consider.
We are open everyday but Christmas day so that helps the costing!!
prospero wrote:CMCs are marvellous machines and invaluable for cutting weird shaped openings - letters, etc. But if you cut mainly bog-standard rectangles they can be a bit of an indulgence. Unless you do high volume repeat production work.

The trap is that once you have the beast you will be tempted to get your moneys worth by doing fancy cuts that really aren't essential to your business. You might find yourself pushing fancy mounts that people just don't want.
A lot of the mind-boggling CMC-cut mounts that you see are done to sell CMCs. If you are only doing 10 or so mounts per day I would think carefully about it.
I actually do only want to do straight forward mounts rectangular mounts but would like to more double mounts to add value to our prints but as we some times are framing large prints in 1 to 2 hours the added speed and accuracy seem to make the cmc make sense. Also our most popular prints are 110x70cm outer mount size and are too big for the inexperienced to cut and even the more experienced end up with failures which obviously pretty much write off the whole board (as we make very few small fames).

That said what do you do with a growing pile of glass measuring between 40-50cm x 90cm? It did not matter to much when it was whitewater glass but now we only use Truevue GL55 it is going to be a very expensive pile of offcuts, about 50 sheets at the moment!
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by prospero »

Actually, there is something I have always wondered about CMCs and perhaps users can enlighten me....

How does it do double mounts? Do you have to cut the two layers separately and then faff about sticking them together in perfect alignment?

:roll:
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Roboframer

Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Roboframer »

With some, I believe but not with the Valiani. You can stick up to three boards together, it cuts each in turn prompting you to remove the fallouts first...... and it will firstly emboss/V Groove/ pen line/whatever the top mount if you want!



As for glass wastage - it might be worth comparing cut-to-size prices, Wessex deliver in Cornwall. Could also be an idea to get someone like Merlin to do your mounts for you too so's there's no wastage there either - or CMC cost!
Roboframer

Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Roboframer »

prospero wrote:CMCs are marvellous machines and invaluable for cutting weird shaped openings - letters, etc. But if you cut mainly bog-standard rectangles they can be a bit of an indulgence. Unless you do high volume repeat production work.

The trap is that once you have the beast you will be tempted to get your moneys worth by doing fancy cuts that really aren't essential to your business. You might find yourself pushing fancy mounts that people just don't want.
I've had a CMC for almost 5 years now, have done very few fancy cuts and don't intend doing many more. An arch isn't fancy, try one of those manually! Even if it's got 'shoulders' it's two machines and if it hasn't ... pretty much forget it. Same goes for ...

Some ovals & circles, rounded corners, stepped corners triangles, hearts, 'L' shapes, octagons, diamonds, stars and much more. All Simple shapes.

Then there's other capabilities like multiple apertures (like 50 cig cards at a click or two, double, triple whatever .... maybe stick an oval central for a laugh - to describe the collection!) thicker boards, reverse bevels, V grooves, open V grooves, embossing, scoring etc etc!

Not much interest for the OP maybe ... just for the record :-)
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Abacus »

To cut double mounts on a wizard you cut the outside of the top mount to the correct size and stick it in the machine face down (telling it to cut the mounts stacked). It clamps the mount in and cuts the aperture. It then moves the cutting head out of the way but keep the mount clamped. You then atg the next mount to the back of the previous and tell it ok. It then cuts the aperture in the next mount.

At the end of the process the mounts are all stuck together with the apertures perfectly aligned. It's magic
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Abacus »

If you were closer to me I'd buy your glass offcuts! (Although I'm in fowey at the moment, but my car is full)
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Whitewater Gallery »

We have 40 or so prints all of differing sizes plus my photos. Today we have sold 6 framed prints, 5 different sizes, it is just not possible to store all the different sizes required in a 5m x 7m cellar where we also have a 24" and 44" and a heat press to make coasters and placemats.
Cellar.jpg
Cellar.jpg (337.44 KiB) Viewed 15989 times
At the moment we keep 2 of each print mounted and wrapped in cellophane but they often come out with marks on them so cutting fresh, quickly and accurately with CMC seems to be logical to me. We also want a top quality product so I am assuming that the CMC will give better constancy than the Ultimat.
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Abacus »

The best thing about a cmc is repeatable accuracy. You'll be able to save all your sizes and then just call them up:

Cut me a "common size 1" whilst I get on with something else!

We seldom throw "bad" mounts away anymore.
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Merlin »

Roboframer wrote:With some, I believe but not with the Valiani. You can stick up to three boards together, it cuts each in turn prompting you to remove the fallouts first...... and it will firstly emboss/V Groove/ pen line/whatever the top mount if you want!
I will correct you there Robo - The Valiani will cut up to three boards together (stacked mounts-ATG'd if you wish). Face Up. As you say it will cut from the top down with the prompt for the internal apertures. If you have put oversized boards in, you will be told to change the blade depth and blade head(ie 90 degree - if you wish) and it will cut the external in one pass.
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Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by IFGL »

we cut face down with the blue head then stick the next mount on top then cut the next ap and so on.
Roboframer

Re: CMC work bench!!

Post by Roboframer »

Merlin wrote:I will correct you there Robo - The Valiani will cut up to three boards togethe
The question was "How does it do double mounts? Do you have to cut the two layers separately and then faff about sticking them together in perfect alignment"?

and my answer was "With some, I believe but not with the Valiani"
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