Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

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pinkybanks
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Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by pinkybanks »

I'm now at the stage where I want to start doing some real research into purchasing a CMC. The only expectations/stipulations for my future acquisition are: (a) it must be below my £10K limit (b)be future proof (c)have good residuals at the 3 year point (d) have a operating system that is user friendly.

I'd love to able to see the Wizard, Valiani, and Gunnar up close and personal but guess I'll have to wait until the forthcoming Spring Fair to be able to truly compare them like for like, (if indeed they turn up at all).
I know everyone must do this ‘CMC Research to Death’ and would love to hear their personal experiences of their research.
Are there any CMC users close to Stoke-on-Trent that would allow me access to the bowels of the workshops to promote the virtues of their machines?
aim2frame Stoke picture framing http://aim2frame.moonfruit.com/
stcstc

Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by stcstc »

i did it only a few months ago,

i looked at the 4 main ones

the wizard - i liked the software the best , coming from a graphics background it felt the most comfortable. downside is they only do a big one, dont do a machine for standard sized boards.

the trucut - plus was being able to talk to the guys that actually make a program the machine not just a sales person, really didnt like the software at all

valiani - liked the idea of the pen head, wasnt fussed on the software. simons do a rental scheme, so fits the finacials like you discuss.

gunnar - the one i bought, well rented. Liked the software. compromise was no pen head. but it had built in packaging etc,

so it worked out considerably cheaper up front to rent the gunnar than the valiani, as to get the val i wanted the heads and the packaging software, which didnt make sense to rent. so it worked out like 3 or 4 times more cash up front than the gunnar
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by pinkybanks »

stcstc wrote: gunnar - the one i bought, well rented. Liked the software. compromise was no pen head. but it had built in packaging etc,

so it worked out considerably cheaper up front to rent the gunnar than the valiani, as to get the val i wanted the heads and the packaging software, which didnt make sense to rent. so it worked out like 3 or 4 times more cash up front than the gunnar
Just out of interest, and i hope you dont mind me asking, how much do you pay per month and what is the tie in period of your rental package? Do you also get the oportunity to purchase the machine at a reasonable price, and who is your supplier?
aim2frame Stoke picture framing http://aim2frame.moonfruit.com/
stcstc

Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by stcstc »

gunnar uk are the supplier

i pay 350 euros a month

and there is a deal where if you buy they give you a percentage of the rent paid against the purchase etc

ring me if you wanna chat through it etc i will tell you what little i know, :-)
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by John »

TruCut offer a sub £10,000 dual head machine.

Support and build quality are second to none, and I see they are holding an open week 11th - 16th July
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by zanart »

Before you make a descision, The US website is featuring a new Wizard Model - CMC9000. Not sure if it is released in the UK yet.

http://www.wizardint.com/product_details.cfm?pid=21
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by Keith Hewitt »

Attempting to stay neutral... :wink:

Take a look here....

http://www.getthepictureframing.com/gfaq/cmc.htm

I see its been updated as recently as June 2010

Keep in mind its a USA site,so will be written for USA framers.

Hope this helps you and any others atking the next big step :sweating:
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by Jared Davis CPF, GCF »

Keith Hewitt wrote: http://www.getthepictureframing.com/gfaq/cmc.htm
I see its been updated as recently as June 2010
Keep in mind its a USA site,so will be written for USA framers.
Hope this helps you and any others atking the next big step :sweating:
If only it could be this simple! - but the real problem with a spreadsheet comparison like this, is that it doesn't compare many more vital factors, including the following handful that come to the top of my head -

- Quality of cut
- Precision & Accuracy
- Long term reliability
- Service and support
- Ease of use, and user-friendly-ness
- The reputation of the machine & the company you are buying it from.
- Advanced or useful software features which may be relevant
- The "real" productive speed and output from actually doing a real job... Not just lineal cut speed.
- How often are genunie software upgrades released & do they write their own software, or is it outsourced?
- What's involved with regular maintanence & service & how to keep the machine tuned & calibrated, if you need to.
- Are they a manufactured by a company reknowned for innovation, or just imitation?

Don't assume all CMC"s are created equal - and can all "cut a rectangle" to the same standard.

I've spoken to framers who have openly admitted to me that the've made the wrong decision in a CMC, by basing it off this spreadsheet, and also off advice on a forum - and focusing too much on price. Being a CMC technician myself, I would strongly suggest the following advice:

1. Take your time. There's no rush to " make a decision now"... and if there is - be suspicious.
2. Get a physical, hands-on demo of both the machine, and the software, before deciding. Get used to using the phrase - "OK, Show Me!".
3. Make sure the cut results are up to your standards & expecations. Just be sure first.
4. Just because a brochure may say the CMC is capable of doing something different or unique - doesn't mean it will be easy and straightfoward either. If something interests you, see exactly what's involved first, in order to achieve this. eg: Just because it's a guitar played by Eric Clapton - doesn't mean you'll be able to play like Eric Clapton on it from day one, and the learning curve & time required to get there might be much steeper than you expect.

At the end of the day, I guess the old saying stands - you get what you pay for.

Cheers,

Jared
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by Keith Hewitt »

Thanks Jared :D

I can feel a gentle smack on the back of my hand :oops:

I wish I'd had a Euro for every time I've been asked which CMC do I reccomend. I could retire!
Jared is not so well known in UK.

He has a fantastic grasp of framing, and is a frequent demoer and trainer at overseas shows in Australia, NZ, and the USA.

Sarah Osborne - Gunnar UK, is also pretty good. Have to put that in or she will be slapping me as well :)
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by pinkybanks »

In my CMC search, i discovered a great oportunity on EBAY of a Valiani Supreme IS for VERY good money, (6K and prepared to take offers). Gutted, as I couldnt jump at it and it appears to have gone so guess its time to get my head in the books and view some in the flesh.
Thanks for the advice everyone.
aim2frame Stoke picture framing http://aim2frame.moonfruit.com/
stcstc

Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by stcstc »

just my opinion but i really thing renting is a good way to go at the moment, particularly in this climate

there are rental schemes from at least 3 of the main manufacturers of cmcs

i know the gunnar rental scheme has no length of contract which means if things are going bad or anything, send it back
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by robbiez »

Jared
Are the rental figures on that website, http://www.getthepictureframing.com/gfaq/cmc.htm, correct.

$100 per week for the F1 Hybrid(£66.00 per week) - seems very cheap.
stcstc

Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by stcstc »

as i said above i pay 350 euros, i belive its £300 on the sheet too

i think this is a public figure, ie everyone pays the same etc

ring sarah in gunnar UK, she is very very helpful etc
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by robbiez »

Is that for the Hybrid??
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Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by Jared Davis CPF, GCF »

robbiez wrote:Jared
Are the rental figures on that website, http://www.getthepictureframing.com/gfaq/cmc.htm, correct.

$100 per week for the F1 Hybrid(£66.00 per week) - seems very cheap.
Those figures are based on leasing, not rental. Leasing is always more affordable than rental. Gunnar do not offer rental in the US.

Cheers,

Jared
stcstc

Re: Sub £10K CMC (Which is the best value)

Post by stcstc »

Sorry. Yea it's the hybrid
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