Thoughts on UV glass

Conservation Issues
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Roboframer

Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Roboframer » Thu 04 Dec, 2014 11:49 pm

I've asked 'experts' this question many times .....

You've got two identical pieces of artwork, they are both mounted and framed in the exact same way and are both exposed to identical conditions, be they ideal, good or bad; how long would it take for noticeable fading to happen in each case .... sod it, just in the 'ideal' situation ????

How difficult a question, to an expert, is that?

Trouble is I can't find an impartial expert! All the experts I've ever found are in the trade, either affiliated to a single brand or affiliated to/working for, a company selling more than one brand.

Anyone know any real proper noduff impartial experts?

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by IFGL » Fri 05 Dec, 2014 12:04 am

http://www.drb-mattech.co.uk/index.html it would be nice to find out.

Jamesnkr

Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Jamesnkr » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 1:30 pm

UV glass doesn't stop fading. Only keeping a picture in the dark does.

Roboframer

Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Roboframer » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 2:08 pm

No-one claims it stops it, just helps.

Never heard of dark fading then?

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by JohnMcafee » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 2:54 pm

This is the current state of my on-going UV glass experiment. It shows the result of exposure to four and a half years in our north east facing shop window.

Left panel - no glass
Centre panel - normal 2mm float
Right panel - Tru Vue Conservation Clear

For the first year or so the experiment was photographed monthly.
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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by featurepiece » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 8:10 pm

Wow!! Great experiment John :clap: :clap:

Interesting stuff :D

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by IFGL » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 8:36 pm

Hi John

we have conducted similar experiments and noticed a clear difference after only 6 weeks in a south facing window, knowing what I know now, I want to restart the test with the addition of a alpha mat under mount and alpha mat under mount with uv glass, we stock all types of uv glass so ganna try them all.

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by JohnMcafee » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 8:59 pm

It would be very interesting to see results using the various glass/acrylic options.

Also, I'd like to experiment some time with the possibility of further accelerating the effect using a strobe light fired at point-blank range.
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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Roboframer » Mon 09 Mar, 2015 11:15 pm

It would also be interesting to see the same thing, with the same glass types, exposed to better conditions like.....

Opposite an unprotected window (but set back from it by 3 metres or so)
On both walls at right angles to the same window
On a wall on the same side as the window

Then same again but this time the window has nets that are permanently drawn and curtains or blinds that are drawn from 1800-0900 and a couple of lamps with shades, switched on from 1800-2300.

Then up a windowless passage from both of those windows

Then ........ ??

The list of hanging situations is endless and once the conclusions are drawn on that particular piece of art there's another endless list of types of support and medium!
Then we can start on temperature and atmosphere.

If something is hung somewhere silly, it will fade, UV glass or not, good quality support and medium or not. If it's hung somewhere sensible, it won't - well, not for a loooong time, UV glass or not, etc etc - that's been my experience anyway because what I described above is the situation in my home and many others'!

Ask me which pictures have shown least or no signs of fading!

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Not your average framer » Tue 10 Mar, 2015 10:05 pm

I assume that the test was done with red mountboard. Therefore I think it would be interesting to have a comparison between standard cream core, white core, conservation and museum mountboard types to see if any perform better than others.

Of course, the other test would be to try this with a fine art print, a colour photo, a water colour, and an oil painting to see how U.V. glass compares with standard glass protecting different art media types. I don't know what it would tell us, but I think that the results would be quite informative.

BTW, was this experiment conducted in the shop window, which is part of your shop front, where customers can see it?
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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Roboframer » Tue 10 Mar, 2015 10:25 pm

Not your average framer wrote:the other test would be to try this with a fine art print, a colour photo, a water colour, and an oil painting
Under each of those there must be scores if not hundreds of combinations of support and medium types. I have a limited edition print facing a window that is fine; facing the same window but twice as far back is an original watercolour that is not!

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by JohnMcafee » Tue 10 Mar, 2015 10:27 pm

Yes the experiment has been in the window the entire time.

A lady once picked it up and asked "how much " :)
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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by JohnMcafee » Tue 10 Mar, 2015 11:21 pm

The experiment only ever had one (very limited) purpose for me. To determine if so called uv glass really had any significant effect.

It clearly has.

I thought that other framers might find the experiment of some interest.

What is all the fuss about?
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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Roboframer » Tue 10 Mar, 2015 11:45 pm

I'm just wondering if the same test in good to ideal conditions would prove you don't need no stinkin' UV glass and that's why it hasn't been done!

Or maybe, in the case of 'good' conditions 92% (reflective) versus 98% (absorptive) would show no difference.

etc - but what we definitely know is that bad conditions fade stuff whatever.

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by JohnMcafee » Wed 11 Mar, 2015 9:51 am

I use the experiment as a deal clincher, it lets customers see with their own eyes how uv glass slows the fading process, without resorting to explanations or getting into science of it.

In a similar vein, and for my own enlightenment, maybe it is time to think about some sort of practical experiment with mountboard. Who knows, maybe this zeolite thing will turn out to be not entirely smoke and mirrors after all...
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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Roboframer » Wed 11 Mar, 2015 11:33 pm

Artcare has a great range of colour and finish with more colours in oversized and extra thick than most in UK if not all. The basic specification without the zeolites beats that of many conservation boards and the price is competitive.

The highest % blocking UV glass (single layer) shifts colour and has a ripple, small price to pay if you need it I suppose, but do you?

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Re: Thoughts on UV glass

Post by Not your average framer » Thu 12 Mar, 2015 12:31 am

I don't know if anyone else has realised it, but if we can agree upon a standardised experiment to be conducted by many members of this forum, we have the chance to produce an unbiased and credible demonstration of the relative merits of different types of glass and mountboards.

This would be of enormous advantage to all framers, in that we would be able to demonstrate real and meaningful levels of performance of different glass and mountboard products on a like for like basis. Hopefully we would be able to gain a practical and more meaningful understanding of what the specified proformance figures actually mean in real life situations.

Each framer participating would be testing a range of products as one experiment where all the conditions would be the same for each item tested and the results obtained by each framer could be cross compared with the results from other framers and any results which do not correlate with the mass of other results can be considered as unreliable.
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