Undermount

[girlfromkent]

Hello

Before I go on I should say how helpful I am finding this forum. Thank you all.

My question is re undermounts. I'm just reading the trade guild's five levels of framing so I understand that commended level and above should have an undermount, but I'm wondering if this is standard practice for most jobs people get.

Do you tend to always undermount, unless the customer is specifically cost cutting?

If so, what board do you use as standard? What tape?

I'm also debating backing boards. I'd been advised to use conservation artbak for everything. What are your views?

Thanks in advance
Megan

[prospero]

I always use an undermount. Usually the same mountboard as the window mount, using offcuts or board I have a
lot of or stuff I don't use much. In my view it's not a proper mount if it isn't a hinged 'bookmount'.

As for backing board, I find the so-called 'conservation' boards to be too unsubstantial. I use 2.5mm MDF as standard.
If you want to, you can always insert a sheet of Mylar or Polyprop wrapping film to act as a moisture barrier.

I have found that even using bog-standard materials the main 'conservation' factor is how the frame gets treated after
it leaves your charge. People hang them on damp walls or store them in damp rooms. They place the in full sun, etc.

I recntly had a painting (which I did) and framed about 1984 in for reframing. In those days I didn't really take account of
conservation and all the mountboard available then was good old cream core. No undermount and a hardboard back.
Despite this the painting had not suffered, probably because it had resided in favourable conditions. I can't help but wonder
if it had been framed in all the bells'n'whistles conservation materials and techniques whether it would have fared as well
if it had been neglected and subject to adverse conditions.

One thing that people tend to disregard it the nature of the item itself. There is a huge difference between a Rembrandt etching
and postcard. Some items are as tough as old boots and some are very delicate and vulnerable. This factor should be taken into
account when deciding on the standard of framing. I have noticed that very old and valuable items tend to be far more
hardy than something little Tommy did at school.

[Justintime]

I book hinge an undermount as standard practice, always using the same quality as the mount. It's not considered good practice to mount work to the window.
I use Nitto/Art white self adhesive tape for the book hinge, or white paper gummed tape, as required.
For mounting artwork nearly always the same white paper gummed tape. I had a self adhesive tape fail once, when hung above a radiator (no surprise), so I don't bother with it anymore.
For backboard I use a range of Corricor/Art bak boards depending on the level of framing.
I also sandwich 99% of jobs. I found it quicker to sandwich than keep checking and refitting because of dust inside the package.

[Not your average framer]

Hinging the undermount to the window mount is so quick and easy. It only takes seconds and it's well worth doing. Idon't hardly think about it, it just gets done and I like peopl to know that I do thinks properly. Why wouldn't I the money that you can save is pointless, it really is so little and is not worth risking you reputation for. You only get one chance to do it right, so why cut corners and not do it right. It does not make sense, not to do the best you can. Period!

I use a variety of backing boards according to what the job requires, but one of the main ones is the Simons solid core one with a water resisant brown outer face and a white, so called conservation face on the inside. As far as I know there is not any recognised specification for conservation backing boards, so as to how conservation friendly any of these (so called) conservation backing boards may be, I don't know, but at least it's a step in the right direction.

The hinging tape that I use depends upon is a white acid free tape, which I wet with the roller in the licky sticky tape machine and it takes seconds to do this. The water gets changed most days, to avoid things getting manky. I the hot weather, I sometimes get flies buzzing around, so I put out some water for them in a saucer on the window sill of my back room and add a few drops of meths.

After the flies have refreshed themselves, the flies that drink the water and the meths leaves them on the outside of the saucer, too drunk to fly away and they get rinsed away in the sink and down the plug hole. Otherwise they like to try and get into the water reservoir in the licky sticky machine. The flies that drink the water with the meths end up as drunk as skunks and probably die happy.

[girlfromkent]

It's not considered good practice to mount work to the window.

Does that mean you don't fix the artwork to the mount at all? The method I'd been shown is two short pieces of PH70 to attach the artwork to the window. No? Never or just not for conservation?

I also sandwich 99% of jobs. I found it quicker to sandwich than keep checking and refitting because of dust inside the package.

Umm, sandwiches? Can you describe this? At the mo I'm thinking cheese and pickle...

I want to do things correctly from the start... if something is worth doing, it's worth doing well and all that.

[Justintime]

@girlfromkent if you already have the FATG study guide, then follow it. It's only the beginning..
No, never mount on the window mount, always on the undermount.
Sandwich = make a book hinge, mount the work on the undermount, close it, position glass on top. Then tape all edges together. It's then ready to store in the drawer. Make the frame, drop in the "package", backboard, tabs, tape (sekisui or gummed brown tape, as required) done!
Best advice is apply for the FATG Scholarship from LarsonJuhluk, free training, so much support! It sounds scary but it was so worth it. It opens up some big doors, in terms of learning. Membership of the FATG amongst other things, gives you access to the helpline, access to professional advice. It's saved me a few times when jobs have me short in ideas.

[Not your average framer]

The window mount has already had a potentially substantial area removed for cutting the window, hanging a possibly heavy artwork from the top border of the artwork can in some circumstances, over time cause the top border to sag with the weight of the artwork, this cannot sag if the artwork is hanging from the under mount, because in most cases the under mount has no window cut into it.

Also hinging the window mount to the under mount for a landscape artwork usually means that the horizontal edges of the mount will be the longest edges and therefore it will be normal good practice to hinge the window mount along it's top edge to the under mount, therefore adding extra support (particularly for large mounts, with longer top borders( where the hinging to the under mount is adding extra support to the window mount to prevent any suging over the years. The bottom border of the mount cannot sag because it is resting against the bottom of the frames.

It is also not good practice to in any way adhere anything to the front of the artwork, because that is the presentation face of the artwork and if at some time in the future the artwork was to be removed from the mount and displayed without the mount for any reason, the front face of the artwork would show no signs of any effects from being mounted. Artworks that a displayed in horizontal cabinets in museums are mostly displayed as unmounted, without the distraction of mount, or frame.

Artworks that are hinged from the under mount are very easy the inspect periodically, if this is required by the customer to check the ongoing condition of valuable and unreplacable artworks, which are to be keep in the best long term condition. The practice of hinging to the under mount, is not a new thing, but has been both best and normal practise for a very long time.

[Steve N]

Always hinge the window mount to the undermount along the longest side, and always attach the artwork to the undermount as this will support the artwork better, in years to come if the glass gets broken and the customer takes it to a framer, the first thing they will do once they have taken the frame apart, is lift the window mount to see if the artwork has been attached correct, if not they will post a photo on here , well until they have been framing for 20years or more , then they won't bother
I don't agree with making a sandwich of the framing package, because I have enough coming in with broken glass, (framed by a local framer) and the customer has tried to pull out the broken pieces of glass, but because they are taped in, they will not come out, so I'm presented with a frame with shards of glass sticking out as if the picture has exploded

[prospero]

The Book-mount method is a long-established practice. Large public collections don't always all have their art framed
and on display, so they have an enormous amount of stuff book-mounted and stashed away in drawers. Using a bookmount
allows the work to be handled safely. Flipping back the window mount allows the entire work to be studied without touching it.

[Keith Hewitt]

Prospero wrote so they have an enormous amount of stuff book-mounted and stashed away in drawers.

I once visited an exhibition in Leipzig, solely for Museum people.
I learnt much, but one fact sticks with me
96% of what the average museum has at any one time is in storage.
One company did nothing else but supply storage files and boxes.
They told me that they had just had an order from the state museum in Berlin
Who insisted that the storage boxes be delivered already assembled. Normally supplied flat
In the end the museum got their way and instead of 1 lorry , it needed 5 lorries to deliver the boxes already assembled.

[girlfromkent]

Thank you everyone for the replies.

Can anyone share a photo?

If nothing is to be stuck to the front of the artwork (perfectly understandable) then how is the artwork secured to the undermount?

[Justintime]

@girlfromkent if you go to www.larsonjuhl.co.uk they have just put up a series of webinars. Have a look at the one by Jon Price GCF about hinging artwork.

[girlfromkent]

Thanks everyone.

Megan

[prospero]

Thank you everyone for the replies.

Can anyone share a photo?

If nothing is to be stuck to the front of the artwork (perfectly understandable) then how is the artwork secured to the undermount?

Simples. Stick to the back. A 'T' hinge is the normal practice. It's not rocket science but there is a certain skill in doing it.

[grahamdown]

Hi,

if it wasn't for the current lock-down situation i would invite you around to see some examples of how to do it and give any help i can.

Regards,

Graham

[girlfromkent]

Thanks Graham that's really kind of you. Maybe in the not too distant future.

[grahamdown]

sure

[Rainbow]

Do you tend to always undermount, unless the customer is specifically cost cutting?

Yes, always. Apart from when there’s an exception! The undermount enables me to create a sturdy sandwich, as Justintime has described. When you know the art is safely tucked up in a sandwich and there’s no risk of any dirt or damage - phwew, the relief, worth every moment it took to do it!

Very occasionally I’ve had a job which includes, say, a double mount + glass + backboard, and the frame has a tiny rebate so the use of another layer of thickness with an undermount means the package doesn't fit comfortably within the frame. I’ve either still used an undermount and fixed the backboard to the back of the frame instead of fitting it inside the frame; or I’ve attached the art to the mount (please don't expel me ) and reduced the thickness of the package by using a barrier sheet between the art and the backboard instead of an undermount. I would probably do the latter just on smaller pictures but I do it so infrequently that I can’t really generalise.

I went looking for the Wiki pages that used to be down the left hand side of the forum to see if there were any useful pictures but it looks as if they've disappeared

I'm also debating backing boards. I'd been advised to use conservation artbak for everything. What are your views?

I use MDF for backboards. I cut with a knife which creates a miniscule amount of dust, if any. I think I’m right in saying that gummed paper tape doesn’t stick to Artbak, and I prefer gummed tape to self-adhesive plastic tape.

[Not your average framer]

Of course there are times that you have to work within certain limitations and not being able to have a full thickness undermount is one of them, but this does not mean that you can't, do something extra to help maintain the level of protection, that you would have otherwise have been able to obtain. A thinner undermount, can always be suplemented with an additional barrier of perhaps Mylar, or something else that will block any acid passing from the backing board into the undermount.

Then at least you've substituted the missing degree of acid protection provided by the full thickness of the undermount with an acceptable acid barrier to mitigate for the effect of less undermount thickness. It's true that we can't always do everything that we would like to do, but so often there are other ways of still maintaining a full and adequate level of protection by another method.

[Rainbow]

Yes, indeed, I didn't mean to imply that I used any old sheet of paper lying around My barrier sheet of choice is Wessex WBB1 which says the following:

Calcium carbonate buffered

Suitable as a barrier between artwork and backing board

pH value 8.5

Manufactured to FATG Conservation Standards