Starter Kits

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iorek
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Starter Kits

Post by iorek »

Hi Folks

Does anyone have any experience with the DIYFraming start up kit - https://www.diyframing.com/store_viewIt ... ItemID=559

Does anyone else offer kits or is it better to piece it together manually?

Thanks for your time, there is much useful stuff on this forum.
Justintime
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by Justintime »

I'm sure others would agree, that this may be a starter kit, but if you are hoping to frame as a business, it is best to buy it right, once.
I would recommend that you scroll through this adverts section and you will soon see what professional framers are using , compared to what this kit offers.
Framers are retiring all of the time and selling their kit and often loads of materials too.
If you are willing to travel and have access to a van, I would advise being patient, until the right deal comes along.
Once you are familiar with the brands, Morso, Cassesse, Alfa, Keencut, Fletcher Terry, to name a few, you will find regular posts on eBay too.
Good luck!
Justin George GCF(APF)
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iorek
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by iorek »

Thanks Justintime, I will do that. Much appreciated.
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by poliopete »

I agree completely with Justintime. Very practical advice :D

FWIW I travelled to Aberdeen last year for my underpinner and compressor :shock: Well worth the journey. :wink:

Welcome to the Framers Forum by the way :D

Peter.
iorek
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by iorek »

Thanks Peter
Not your average framer
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by Not your average framer »

I notice that the kit includes a Logan mountcutter. I would not go for one of these, for the simple reason that you can only use logan blades which cost a fortune, plus a Logan hobby grade cutter will not be easy to sell when you want to upgrade to something better.
Mark Lacey

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iorek
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by iorek »

Thanks - trying to figure out what equipment is up to the job is proving to be the difficult part. I can see the sense in purchasing a job lot from someone who has been doing it.
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by David McCormack »

Hi and welcome to the FF :D
iorek wrote:...trying to figure out what equipment is up to the job is proving to be the difficult part.
Maybe tell the forum a bit more about yourself and what it is you want to do? Are you wanting to set up as a professional framer or are you maybe an artist wanting to frame your own work for sale?

The trouble with buying a kit is that you get what someone else thinks is the best combination of equipment to use, even if you buy the equipment from a closing business you are buying a kit. It's possible the kit may suit you perfectly but the best kit will be the one you put together yourself.

My advice would be to first and foremost attend a training course, preferably one that is over two days. Courses are often advertised on the forum or you could have a look on the Fine Art Trade Guild website or ask directly on here. The best way to get what you want from the forum is to start a new thread with a specific question such as; training courses in Scotland or what underpinners does everyone use, that sort of thing.

Have a look on the LION website and order one of their catalogues (real paper version) they make great bedtime reading :oops:

As for the kit in your link, there are only two items I would consider purchasing... the Toyo glass cutter and the Alfa underpinner.

FYI this is my kit:

Morso guillotine, foot operated
Cassese CS88 underpinner, foot operated
Keencut Ultimat Gold manual mount cutter, 48 inch
Toyo glass cutter and Resin L Square, sloping bench covered with carpet tiles
Various Fletcher hand point drivers

Have a look in the workshop of most framers and you will see a green Morso guillotine somewhere! A new foot operated one will set you back the best part of £2k but it would be a very good investment. But a second hand Morso (mine was) will be just as good as a new one and maybe invest in a new set of blades. Morsos come up on here every now and then and also on ebay. The ones on ebay can be in a bit of a sorry state. Mark Thornton, a forum member, sometimes has refurbished ones on his website.

This one on ebay looks good? Looks like there is a finger guard missing but you can pick up a pair from Mark Thornton's website.

Cassese underpinners are very popular with most framers as are the Alfa range. Don't think they make the CS88 anymore but again should be ok secondhand. I think the new Cassese foot operated underpinner is the CS1? Foot operated is ok if you mainly want to use soft woods such as obeche, pine and tulipwood. A lot of factory finished moulding is made of obeche and also pine. If you want to use hard woods like oak, you may want to think about a pneumatic air operated underpinner... ask other forum members for info on these machines.

The two main players in mount cutters are Keencut and Fletcher. Get a 48 incher so you can cut a full sheet of board. If you can, buy new, but good condition second hand ones do come up every now and then. Both mount cutters can do straight cuts as well as bevels so you can cut your back board on them with ease, especially the fluted boards. Solid back boards (Kraft covered grey board) are more dense and require a couple of passes with the blade. Both will do 10mm foamboard no problem.

Vertical wall mounted sheet cutters are very popular with framers for cutting glass and all your sheet materials but they aren't cheap. I cut all my sheet material on my Ultimat Gold except of course my glass. I made a sloping bench big enough to take a full sheet of glass which is 48 x 36 inches. The slope on the bench makes it easier to reach to make a score on a full sheet. I use a Toyo glass cutter and one of these L squares.

I find the Fletcher hand point drivers more than adequate for my needs but if you intend to make many frames a day you may want to consider an air operated point driver, again you will need to ask other forum members for advice on these. I should have said, a point driver is the tool you use to fix everything in your frame.

Just to say again, get yourself on a training course and then consider which equipment is best for you.

Good luck :D
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iorek
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by iorek »

Thanks for that, loads of info there to digest.

It's starting to become a little clearer for me. I've enquired about courses and hopefully at the end of that I will have a clear idea of what machinery I want to use.

Next stage is to start thinking of all the sundries... :)
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by prospero »

I would reiterate the previous advice. :D Buy as you need. A 'workshop in a box' is not a good way to do it.

When I started, one of the local framers was moving premises and selling boxes of offcuts for next the nothing. I got a few
and used them to learn Morso cutting. Better than practising on prime stock. :? I'm sure there are many framers within a
reasonable distance who would gladly furnish you with a carload of bits'n'pieces. :P
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by Not your average framer »

Try to spend your money where it really counts. If you are aiming to be working to a professional standard, the you will be best aiming for a Morso, a reasonable underpinner and a reasonable mountcutter. Start with the neccesities and buy the rest afterwards. You do not have to buy new, but if you are buying secondhand then you may do well to seek opinions on this forum before you consider buying items that you may not known much about. Seeking advice on this forum can also be helpful if you are buying new equipment as well.

There are plenty of forum members who have long term experience of different makes and models of most types of framing equipment, so don't be afraid to ask. If your budget will run to it, it may be worth considering a wall mounted board and glass cutter. I bought a Keencut System 4000 wall mounted cutter about 18 years ago and it has been great in spite of being quite old when I bought it. Some secondhand items are work horses that go on for ever and will help you stretch your money further.
Mark Lacey

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iorek
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Re: Starter Kits

Post by iorek »

Thanks folks for the input and advice, it is very much appreciated.

I'm currently trying to price good quality second hand machinery so I have an idea of what the going rate is. I've also had tentative discussions with a nearby framer who is looking to retire. He has very good equipment, probably too good, but there may be an opportunity there. His setup chimes very much with what I have been reading throughout the forum and that is reassuring.

Cheers everyone.
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