Framing prints from books for resale - legal or not?

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sfandp
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Framing prints from books for resale - legal or not?

Post by sfandp »

I recently came across a company who had a stand at RHS Hampton Court Flower show who we're taking prints/plates from old books (mainly children's books) and mounting and framing them for resale. However, they claim they are not able to photograph the framed or mounted items for their own website because this would infringe copyright. OK to sell them, but the process of,photographing the "new" item is classed as copying. Does anybody know the "ins and outs" of this tricky subject? Thanks. Carol
Not your average framer
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Re: Framing prints from books for resale - legal or not?

Post by Not your average framer »

Copyright law is quite easy to understand. If you are copying a framed picture to display it as an example of your work, then unless the copyright owner believes that you have derived some financial gain from doing this, then you have not breached copyright.

However if you have made a financial gain, then you are deriving from copying someone else's intelectual property and they were entitled to determine if they wanted to, how much they were willing to charge you for the use of their intelectual property.

Copyright normally remains in force until 70 years after the death of the originator of the intelectual property item, but there are often cunningly implemented legal exceptions to this, so don't assume this this is always true.

An obvious trick could be for a book publisher reprinting a book and digitally embedding something in an image which although it is not visible to the naked eye, it can be argued as the publishers intelectual property. Such methods can be employed by publishers to protect images which continue to be published beyond the 70 years after the originator death.

Added to this if the originator has granted rights to a book publisher to reproduce his own images in a book, then someone removes these images from the book to mount, or frame them images, then this can be considered as breach of copyright by unauthorised conversion.

Generally speaking, a certain amount of common sense needs to be exercised in such cases. Buying newly published books with the intent of converting images to sell as mounted, or framed prints would probably be undefendable in a court of law, if the publisher had cunningly taken action as described above.

However, doing the same with a book published before the natural copyrignt expired (70 year after the death of the originator) and then converting it after the expiration of the copyright, should not normally result in and breach of copyright, unless the publisher had not already added something of the own itelectual property.

Added to this at the original point of sale as a retail item, it could be argued that a contract existed between the purchaser and whoever specified that a copyright statement should be included in the purchased book, to the effect that if the book was purchased by the original purchaser with intent to convert the images to seperate salable items, then intent to breach copyright could reasonably be assumed.

Buying the same book secondhand and as an already old and obviously used book, would probably not cause any legal problems if the 70 year rule no longer applied, due to the passage of time.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
Roboframer

Re: Framing prints from books for resale - legal or not?

Post by Roboframer »

Simple really :wondering:

Welcome to the forum, Carol.

I don't like this practice, not unless the artwork is faithfully described as a page ripped out of (removed from) a book, which most don't. I've just framed something described thus ....

"c 1844 fine lithograph with original hand colour finish by Francois Grenier (1793-1867) Guaranteed over 160 years old"

Mount carpet-taped to backing so it cannot be easily opened to see it was ripped out of a book, which, sure, was 160 years old .... but the page was probably hand coloured very recently. Very very misleading.
Not your average framer
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Location: Devon, U.K.
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Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Framing prints from books for resale - legal or not?

Post by Not your average framer »

Unless you really know what you are doing, antique prints is not an easy business to be successful in. I used to do it for a living, but at the time I was also an antiquarian and secondhand bookdealer, so I knew which prints came from which books and how much to pay for them.

Finding the right books at the right price is the really difficult thing these days. Back in the 1970's, lots of bookdealers were buying up antique print books and making a good living from breaking the books for the prints. These days the books are really hard to find at any price at all.

Sure, there are modern repro books around, but they have the prints are not engraved, so they are worth almost nothing. Most of the antique prints shops are now long gone, due to the lack of suitable books and the fact that the fashion for buying old prints is long past.

I'm still mounting, or sometimes even framing some left over prints, to sell in our favourite Devon auction house, but the money is a long way below what it once was and to make it worth doing I sell prints in batches. Sorry, but that's how it is!
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
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