Large flag

lynnbmack · Post by **lynnbmack** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 9:20 am

Have had a potential customer in looking at options for framing/hanging a regimental flag approx 3ft x 63". I have advised them that for that size of frame it would be better behind perspex for safety etc and would be costly, but my main query is what to attach it onto as the boards only go up to 60x40", or can you get larger ones? if so where - my geographical situation would probably cause another issue re delivery! The only board I can see that is larger in Neilsen's is 4mm thick which would present a real problem with sewing/attaching it on! My fingers aren't that tough! (and I'm only 5'1"!!)

I don't know if they will decide to get it framed as they got a bit of a shock at how much it might cost, but wanted to see what the feedback/ideas on here would be.

Post by **prospero** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 9:30 am

I would be inclined to sew the flag to a larger piece of suitable fabric and put the whole thing on canvas stretcher bars. This would make it lighter and more stable.

Never actually done this btw.

But I think the principle is sound...

ps. Work on this scale should always demand a premium price.

lynnbmack · Post by **lynnbmack** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 10:02 am

Oops just noticed I posted this in After hours - should have been general discussion - sorry!

That sounds like quite a good idea - simple and light.

I told the client another option would be to put some fabric loops to the top end and hang it over a dowel rod or similiar - it depends on the value of the item really.

If they decide to frame it - it will be a premium price for my stress levels!!

Steve N · Post by **Steve N** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 12:51 pm

[quote="prospero"]I would be inclined to sew the flag to a larger piece of suitable fabric and put the whole thing on canvas stretcher bars. This would make it lighter and more stable.

Never actually done this btw.

But I think the principle is sound...

Hi Lynn
This is the same way that I would do the job, but stretch the fabric on the stretchers first, then sew the flag on to the stretched fabric. If you do it the otherway around, you might find you are stretching the flag not the fabric.

Hope this helps

Steve

Post by **prospero** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 1:04 pm

Even better.

lynnbmack · Post by **lynnbmack** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 1:23 pm

Yes, I think this sounds quite a good way to approach this job - certainly a lot lighter than a frame - they won't need to reinforce their wall to hold it!

Will keep you posted as to whether they decide to go ahead or not - if not, who knows when I will need this advice!

Roboframer · Post by **Roboframer** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 6:16 pm

By stretching it in this way are you going to rule out glass altogether?

If not it will end up just as heavy, if not more so and there will be more difficulty in spacing the glass from the flag.

I'd recommend glass and this is what I'd do in that case.

Join two pieces of 5mm foamboard with bevelled joints on top of the same again and paste the top and bottom boards together - make sure the joints top and bottom are staggered. Back the whole thing with something sturdier after the flag is stitched in place.

A hasty side-on diagram .......

No need to tape the joints - you can paste the bevels.

If the flag is going to the edge of the board with no backing showing (close framed) then that's it - or you could make it even bigger by adding some space around - in that case I'd cover the board with fabric.

Then stacked frame - glazing between.

osgood · Post by **osgood** » Wed 03 Oct, 2007 7:59 pm

Aren't 8ft x 4ft foamboard sheets available up there?

Robo's solution to that is a good one and instead of a 'sturdy backing', the foamboard panel could be fixed to a wooden frame made from 3 x 1's like a stretcher, but with several cross pieces that are flush with the front surface.

Not your average framer · Wed 03 Oct, 2007 9:18 pm

lynnbmack wrote:boards only go up to 60x40", or can you get larger ones? if so where

Wessex Pictures do a 10mm thick foamboard which is 4ft x 8th.

It's a real pain cutting something that big to size.

I've got a job in which has been blocking up my workshop for about a year. The guy brought it in and left it for me to quote. Then disappeared for ages, then spent ages desiding about where he was going to pay that much, then went to hospital and spent months there. Now he's out again and we are trying to get it finished so he can take it away, before he can disappear again.

Not your average framer · Wed 03 Oct, 2007 9:28 pm

prospero wrote:I would be inclined to sew the flag to a larger piece of suitable fabric and put the whole thing on canvas stretcher bars. This would make it lighter and more stable.

We've got a 4ft x 8ft canvas in to frame right now and the artist bought it ready made on stretcher bars, I don't know if it's off the self or made to order, or where it came from, but they obviously can be got from somewhere!

Not your average framer · Wed 03 Oct, 2007 9:31 pm

Opps, thinking about it, it's not 4ft x 8ft, but 4ft x 6ft. Sorry.

Post by **prospero** » Thu 04 Oct, 2007 12:48 am

If I could hi-jack this topic somewhat and go off at a not-entirely-unrelated tangent.....

BIG frames.

Not everyone has a workshop the size of an aircraft hangar so how do you folks tackle jobs that are too big for the workshop? I was recently asked to frame an oriental drawing which was not only very fragile but 10ft long. The customer wanted it mounted on silk, which was a good idea but the practicalities would have been horrendous. Thats before I tried to make a frame that long (with glass). I decided not to undertake the challenge. I presently have a 5ft sq oil to do. No glass to bother with but the finished job will be 6ftsq which doesn't sound enormous but any bigger and I couldn't get it out the door. Plus, it will be handfinished.

Hope the wheather keeps fine so I can work on it in the yard.

A mate of mine recently did a 9ftx8ft h/f frame about 10" wide. It looked absolutley collossal laid on his bench. Fortunately he does have a workshop the size of an aircraft hangar, but I remember at the time him puzzling just how he was going to transport the finished article....

I once saw a photo in a framng mag of a framed tapestry about 16ft x4ft. (Glazed!!). The two guys who made it where posing outside their shop. The frame was longer than the shop front. I remember reading how they had to special order the moulding from the Swedish manufacturer in long lengths.

What's the biggest frame anyone has tackled? And did you wish you had never started it.

markw · Post by **markw** » Thu 04 Oct, 2007 3:30 pm

Renaissance mouldings will supply custom size srtetchers tel 01992764666. At that size they need lots of cross braces.

Not your average framer · Thu 04 Oct, 2007 7:17 pm

prospero wrote: What's the biggest frame anyone has tackled? And did you wish you had never started it.

I'm doing it now, it's mentioned earlier is this thread. When completed it will have an external size of approx 6' 6" x 4' 6" and it will be very heavy. I greatly regret having agreed to do it. I WILL NOT AGREE TO DO ANOTHER!

Don't think it won't affect your capacity to do your normal work, it will! It will prevent you using more of your workshop space than you ever expected. BE WARNED!

Roboframer · Post by **Roboframer** » Thu 04 Oct, 2007 7:31 pm

Mine was 8x4' in that big arqadia frame that looks like one big un-mors-able one but is actually two inside each other.

But my underpinner is sunk into the corner of a 12x6' workbench.

Incidentally - I'd prefer my method above to one huge sheet of 10mm foamboard - it's stronger as there are 4 layers of barrier paper instead of 2 and you'll (probably) be using stuff you always have in stock.

Who wants to despatch one sheet of 8x4' foamboard and who wants to buy a pack of the stuff anyway.

osgood · Post by **osgood** » Thu 04 Oct, 2007 7:44 pm

Roboframer wrote: Who wants to despatch one sheet of 8x4' foamboard and who wants to buy a pack of the stuff anyway.

I buy 8' x 4' boxes of 5mm foamboard all the time. It's the most economical size! The only reason I can see for not wanting to buy that size is lack of storage space. The box stands upright on one end with the edge cut open so I can slide sheets out.

I also have in stock one or two 60x40 box of Artcare 5mm, one box of 32x40 Artcare 3mm, one box of 60x40 self adhesive, one box of 60x40 13mm, one box of 60x40 standard 3mm.

Just like hard drive space, you can't have too much foamboard!

ross · Post by **ross** » Fri 05 Oct, 2007 11:11 am

Haven't done a flag for some years now, but the last one we had, we secured the flag to a solid backing board (matt-board mounted over 3mm MDF) by screwing through the two metal eyelets on the flag into the backing board and then placing over the screw head a chrome dome to hide it - the flag just hung perfectly flat within the frame, and continues to do so to this day

We did experiment with securing the flag to a piece of fabric over a stretcher bar, but because of the weight of the flag it didnt just sit flat, but wrinkled - thats why we went with a solid backing. When we mount large fabric items like this we prefer to secure them at the top and allow the item to hang loosely

Ross

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