Framing Stained Glass

[RobM]

I've a client coming in to discuss a stained glass panel that he would like framed. As this is a new to me, I'm curious as to if there are any special considerations I need to allow for for such a project.

I've looked at a few videos online, and a couple seem to use channeled frames to hold the glass. I'm hoping this isn't the norm, as I'm not yet a dab hand at routing - unless you can readily buy pre-channeled mouldings.

[Justintime]

I have done a couple of smallish 300x450 panels.
Things I would look out for:
- is the piece flat?
-is the lead work in good condition, retaining structural integrity?
- how off square is it?
I used a strong oak moulding, with oak spacers behind, flush with the back, allowing it to be hung/stood up in front of a window.
If the panel is sagging at all I'd consider putting it behind glass for additional strength/protection. It's one of those jobs that until it's in your hands you don't really know what you're getting into.

[pramsay13]

It's been discussed in the past on here so if you search for stained glass you should get a few options to read through.

I've done a couple before. One was done as Justin describes with a normal frame with spacers behind to hold it in place. The issue with that is that it doesn't look finished from the other side, so if it's to be displayed in a downstairs window it might not look great.

It is possible to get u-channel moulding although it isn't common. If you do get it the stained glass would sit in place and look finished from both sides, although you then have the issue of fixing it in place as using wedges will be seen from one side.

The other one I made a larger box frame with LED lights around it and the old stained glass window was fixed inside so it gave the impression of being see-through and lit up even though it was on a normal wall.

[RobM]

Thanks Justin and Peter for the feedback.

The client came in, and it's just a small, flat panel, roughly 300x200 and so not heavy at all. Plus it's square enough to not cause any concerns. Though I noticed there was no outer lead frame (presumably because it's relatively small?).

We selected an oak moulding, and the plan was just glue/silicone the panel into it; though it was discussed that I could add a spacer, as Justin mentioned, for further stability. The idea of an additional sheet of glass is a useful option, Justin, but I think this one will be okay without.

I appreciate what you're saying, Peter, about the other side appearing unfinished; in this case, the client was fine with this in this instance, but it would be useful to look for more complete solutions for future such pieces. The plan was for it to be mounted with a chain, and so the brackets holding the chain would be mounted on the back anyway.

Peter, if you've got any photos handy, I'd be keen to see that box you did.

[RobM]

Just on this project, I was planning on gluing the glass panel into the frame, as per Lion's recommendations, and to save on having get framers points involved.

Does anyone think this might be a bad idea?

[vintage frames]

When you say 'gluing it in', what sort of glue do you mean?
I'm not familiar with the Lion advice.

[RobM]

Hi Dermot. Essentially, just using a few beads of glue (in this case, I only have a trade name - the AP5 sticks that go with the Bosch gun) in the frame recess, before dropping the panel in.

I've been practicing this morning with a spare. Neither as easy or workable as I'd hoped.

I'd still like to use a spacer, so perhaps I'd be better off just glueing that in (less risk of mess, more surface area if glueing the sides), rather than the glass itself.

[vintage frames]

If it was me, I'd secure the stained glass object into the rebate with a few dabs of silicone, all around. Then add in some spacers to make things look nice.
Once again, barewood spacers, painted black would be my choice.

Don't worry about having bad ideas.
I'll take on anyone when it comes to competitive stupidity.

[JKX]

Posted in error!

[Justintime]

I'd be reluctant to glue/silicone the piece into place as it's notoriously difficult to remove silicone at a later date. If the spacer will secure it then gluing it in as well is unnecessary imo. I'll always consider how I'd want to find it, if the customer brings it into me for reframing in five years time. A few days of glue on each spacer and a clamp while each one dries would be more easily reversible than fully glueing them in.

[vintage frames]

And that's the advice you get from a proper picture framer.
Don't use the glue.

I'm not a proper picture framer. I just make frames for people who own expensive art and when I do have to handle the art, then its all guns blazing with the full museum grade materials and practice.

For the stained glass in question, I would make a quick pragmatic assessment and as I said, use a few small dabs of silicone to hold it in place and then glue in some spacers.
If I thought the piece required it, I might not use the glue, cushion it with some foam inside the rebate and then clamped and held it in place with the spacers.
It's the decision that the customer and framer can make when agreeing what's best inside the budget.

[RobM]

I'm liking the Dermot and Justin double act!

Admittedly, being warded off from using glue is something of a relief for me; it's messy to use and I have too many reservations about damaging artwork and frames from awry use of it. And of course not using it for conservation purposes makes a lot of sense.

I think the thing I'm not quite getting though is how I could safely secure everything without it.

This is a photo of the project, which I've now made a spacer for. The question is how to get points (or something of the same function) in to hold it all together. If only there was a product that could overcome this problem while sitting within the narrow depth of the spacer.

The little mock-up on the side of the photo shows just how far points would protrude over the spacer.

[vintage frames]

I can't see why you're using points.

This should be just a simple job of the spacers holding the glass inside the frame.
When 'not using glue' is mentioned, it really refers to not attaching any glue to the artwork/stained glass itself.

Why not cut the spacers neat to fit inside the frame, paint them black, wipe some wood-glue along their lengths and pop insde the loaded frame.
Maybe use some masking tape to hold the spacers tight whilst the glue sets.

It's always good to have a discussion, any sort of discussion on this forum.
Better than just being an undertaking directory for framing equipment.

[Justintime]

I'd think about Volará foam rebate tape first, to give the piece a bit of a cushion, then the piece, then fit your spacers. You could join your spacers on an underpinner first (but it's tricky to get any glue in that way) and then use a headless pinner to hold in place. You could take each piece of spacer and position with a couple of dabs of glue and clamp into place til dry. I usually reverse mitre them for the tightest finish. Then tape the back.

[RobM]

This is good, thanks again guys.

So...I appreciate that not glueing would be to maintain the integrity of the artwork foremost. I just figured that glueing in a spacer that could then have to be unattached in future could risk damaging the piece in doing so. At the same time, I'm sure it's also perfectly doable.

Okay, so I WILL glue the spacer into the frame. I particularly like this idea of the Volara tape (as long as it isn't so thick as to leave a discernible gap).

Regarding the headless pins - Justin, are you meaning to hold the spacer together, or to pin the spacer onto the frame?

[pramsay13]

When I'm sticking in spacers I use double sided tape and wood glue. The tape holds the spacers in place until the glue goes off.

Looking at the first photo with the points, you could use a canvas offset instead, but flipped around to hold everything in place if you're worried about the glue holding.