'Home Working' - a nagging doubt ...

[Bagpuss]

Excuse the glut of postings lately but I'm just setting up a 'proper' full-time business and suddenly find myself scratching my head alot ...

Does anyone out there operate from a workshop at home ? I've got a 'converted' garage which I've used for years, it's quite respectable looking inside, it could do with a bit more space and I have to keep my moulding in a hired sea container a mile away ( not ideal ) but it's better than the expense of a high street shop at this stage of my career I guess.

I've tried not to think about it but I have this nagging doubt that someone from the local council will be paying me a visit in the next few months saying that I should not be operating a business from my garage

Given that I live in a leafy suburb and that customers will have to ring and book an 'appointment' rather than turning up ad-hoc, I'm wondering what hurdles anyone else has experienced in setting a home-based workshop ?

Only positive anecdotes please ....

Thanks,
B'Puss

[Roboframer]

It's possible you could need planning permission for 'change of usage' - depends on the anoraks/jobsworths in the planning dept and how many NIMBYs you have around you who might enquire whether you have it because you dropped a piece of glass one day and woke their cat up.

What we did was write to the planners before we started, informing them of our intentions and describing the levels of noise (hardly any if any at all and less than some car enthusiasts). Also explaining that no customers would call - it would all be collection & delivery. We wanted to see see if they'd say we'd need planning permission - rather than apply for nothing, or apply and get refused!

They wrote back saying that as long as customers did not call (possible parking problems) it was fine.

[Bagpuss]

That's just what i wanted to hear, thanks RoboFramer ! I think it would be prudent for me to inform the jobsworths first before they hear second hand ...
Thanks again,
B'Puss

[Not your average framer]

I don't work from home as I have a shop, but from time to time there are customers who ask if I will visit them at their home. I thought that this would present all kinds of difficulties, but it has always worked out and been quite easy. I just take a few moulding catalogues and mountboards selectors and that's about it.

No doubt if this is the way which you have to connect with your customers, then you could get together a samples case and advertise the advantages of have you come to them. The most obvious selling point being for busy people who don't have the time during the day and an evening visit might be the only way it works for them.

As for nagging doubts, well this is a natural part of starting out in business. I can't offer too much help on this, but over time I've found a good many of the things I worried about, turned out not to matter.

Try not to allow these things to drive you too much. At first things seem to be slow, but things which grow slowly usually get there and in reasonable shape. Don't hurry to spend money on the things which you think you need, but don't need yet. The right time and opportunity will come if you wait. I hope things go well for you.

[Roboframer]

Go placidly amid the noise and haste,
and remember what peace there may be in a silent compressor


As far as possible without surrender
be on good terms with all suppliers, especially Simons and Lion.
Speak your truth quietly and clearly;
and listen to customers
even the ones with HK oils
they too have their story.

Avoid loud and aggressive posters
they are vexations to the spirit.
If you compare yourself with others,
you may become vain and bitter;
for always there will be greater and lesser framers than yourself.

Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.
Keep interested in your own career, however humble;
it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.
Exercise caution in your business affairs;
for the world is full of trickery.

But let this not blind you to what virtue there is;
many persons strive for museum glass
and there's always the conservation police

Be yourself.

Especially, do not feign affection.
Neither be cynical about MDF
for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment
it is as perennial as the grass.

Take kindly the counsel of the years,
gracefully surrendering the things of youth.
Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune.
But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings.
Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness.

Beyond a wholesome discipline,
be gentle with yourself.
You are a framer of the universe,
no less than Pete Bingham or Vivian Kistler
you have a right to be here.
And whether or not it is clear to you,
no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God,
whatever you conceive Him to be,
and whatever your labors and aspirations,
in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams,
it is still a beautiful world.
Be cheerful.
Frame to be happy.

Durraing Durraing

[kev@frames]

He's good sometimes, Robo, isn't he


Positive comments:

a friend of mine ran a "garage framing" operation very sucessfully (this means he made a living paid his bills and had a reasonably "normal" social life -for a biker anyway) - He ran this for more than ten years and only gave it up a couple of months back when he decided to retire properly at 70. He had no shortage of work, and minimal overheads.

More positive comments.

The majority of people who work from home "below the radar" not paying tax, rates, fly tipping trade waste in their domestic rubbish or at the local tip, avoiding waste transfer charges, having a residential phone line instead of a business line, etc do get away with it, so they dont have that much to worry about.

However, if you got a shop The Man Already Got You Number, as they say. But on the bright side, you know all that stuff already and wont have any nasty shocks about "being in business".

not that positive, but not actually negative comment:
You are going to have to separate work and home time and work/home areas, else you'll just be at work 24/7 and it'll do your head in. And you will want to keep an area for seeing customers else you will have every tom dick and harry in your home at all hours of the day and night. At least get a second phone line for the business so you can get a break from it.
.

[fineedge]

16 years now in my converted garage and going strong - I suppose municipal regulations differ but the local building inspector/ town planner visited me once because of complaints but turned out it wasn't about me - just asked that my signage hanging in the tree stays as it is 300 x 100 mm board and asked about noise levels - vacuum cleaner the most decibels - normal household "noise' . Some days I see 10 or twelve customers but for some reason they are always spread across the day so parking is no problem. And damn! I enjoy working from home and not having to venture out into the traffic madness.

[Jonny2morsos]

It's possible you could need planning permission for 'change of usage' ............

They wrote back saying that as long as customers did not call (possible parking problems) it was fine.

I think the second sentence is the crux of the matter. We used to work from home but decided to move out when we were getting two or more customers arriving at the same time and realised the neighbours could easily get upset.

Insurance is another matter to consider very carefully.

The benefits are:

No rent, no business rates, no maintenance charges on the rented property, paying legal fees for going over the lease (reckon on 4hrs at usual rip off rates), no deposit to lodge with landlord, no business telephone and broadband, gas, electric. You get to reclaim a certain amount from your tax for using your home.

So add all the above up and then work out how much extra work you need to bring in.

But in the end you will start looking at empty shops/units like most of us, however, get the timing right and do the move at the right time.

Good luck.

John

[kev@frames]

I bet half of us here who work from shops have an exit-plan/retirement strategy that involves a garage and a morso at some point in the future

[foxyframer]

Dear All

Well, the time had to come sometime...

After owning a gallery/framers for about 37 years I,ve had the last big picture sale. Prices really had to be slashed in order to clear the lot in time. Everybody loves a bargain and don't they show their true nature. Sold off all the shop fittings and moved all the other kit back home, where I have an existing studio and workshop.

Best thing I ever did; for me anyway. Since the end of June I have been working from home, brilliant !

A sunny July would have been nice !

No mega k to find, no commute, no PITA timewasters, no retail reliance on good trading weather and no odd quiet days.

No one comes to my home. Email or phone, I go to them with all the matts and mouldings we had on the wall display boards, only in transportable cases. Got to keep it neat and tidy though. Along with a mobile credit card machine. They still love to pay up front still and you don't get late collectors or no shows. Big advantage.

So, no nagging doubts here !

Foxy

[kev@frames]

Nice one, glad the move turned out good.
hope it continues to go well

[DEEPJOY]

Hi All

Still alive and kicking, I hope everyone is well????

I have not posted for a while, just checked every now and then to see what's going on.

The question relating to this topic is, when you are talking about working from home, is this on a full time basis or part time after you have returned from the normal day job? Not that there is such a thing as normal.

For myself, pressures of the day job and performing in a recessionary period has scuppered my picture framing plans. I am still working on the garage workshop,floors to paint and benches to build, just struggling to get to it. Most equipment / tools sorted, business cards printed, pricing software in place and enough enthusiasm to go around for everyone. The only downside is, I will have probably forgotten how to frame when I eventually get started.

One day it will be deepjoy and excitement for me.

[David]

Hi Bagpuss

I have a High Street Shop, been in business since 1993, if I was starting again I'd do it differently. Either a seperate workshop or more likely working from home.

The hassle of rent, rates, local authorities I'd rather not have it.

Save a lot of money, all fixed costs by the way, and spend it on your workshop and extra marketing if you need it.

There are always problems and doubts in business, I still have the same concerns as when I started, the numbers are bigger thats all.

The grass will always look greener I wish I was working in a big garage or a couple of out buildings.

My last bit of advice - keep your fixed costs down.

David.

[daisy]

Hi Bagpuss,

I have read this posting with great interest. I also work from home, and have a little studio/ workshop attached to the house and cut frames, glass etc in the garage. When I first started someone from the council came round, on my request, and said that all was fine as both rooms were being used for other purposes so no planning permission required. The garage also has the car, bikes etc parked in it, the workshop has a sofa bed so is often used as an extra room. I have insurance as well as a certificate to show that all my glass is disposed of appropriately (I have a 240l bin from 'virador' (www.viridor-waste.co.uk) and they charge me £1:90 every time they collect it).

Most customers are by appointment and I think once you do everything by the book you'll be fine. Lots of people work from home in all sorts of capacity so there really is no need to worry. Good luck.

Daisy

[pinkybanks]

I'm off to see a commercial property this evening, it’s the first one I’ve viewed and on paper it looks ideal, on a main arterial route and next to a major shopping location, but truth is I'm scarred witless as I know if I agree there is no going back. The days of indecision and the potential to get a ‘REAL JOB’ will be taken away from me, and I’ll have to turn a regular profit. My angst is the quandary that without a shop window it’s difficult to find new clients, and I’m conscious that operating from my garage (although cheap) doesn’t give me the constant business exposure I ‘THINK’ I need. The majority of my customers are found through word of mouth and it becomes chicken and egg scenario.
I’m looking to buy the property, as apposed to lease as I need to ensure that if it all goes belly up then at least I’ll have a golden egg to fall back on. I also hate the idea of furnishing someone else’s shop for them…

[Jonny2morsos]

We made the move away from home 3 years ago and have just acquired the next door unit (same size) but we do lease. I would like to buy and are hoping to do so at the end of our new lease. We are on an industrial estate so don't let location put you off too much.

Good Luck Adam.

John.

[pinkybanks]

Its just the jump from zero overheads, to £800 per month, scares me to death. Granted its the price of business, but I've no small business experience apart from my recent crash course of reading anything I can get my hands on...

[YPF]

I too work from home. I have a space to deal with customers away from the 'working area' and my family area. I offer a collection and delivery service but will see customers by appointment at home. I think you need to be honest and up front with the council; I have spoken to my local council and received a very relaxed response from them, they are not really interested if I'm not making any noise or using any tools like oxy-acetylene etc.

That said I really would like to have a commercial premises, I will have to see how the business progresses. After a slow start I now find that more and more people are finding me after many hours experimenting to find the right type of advertising.

Today I donated a framed caricature to the local independant hardware shop for a church fete this weekend - that has resulted in an offer from them to display framing samples in their shop and hopefully will lead to more business.

Good luck,

Steve

[Bagpuss]

Hi Steve,

that's interesting to hear about your local council being quite relaxed regarding working from home, I haven't actually notified them yet, I wanted to but I was talked out of it. I'm just waiting for the knock on the door from the man who wants you pay for playing a radio in your own workshop

Good luck with your business, I've only just woken up to how much is involved with promoting the business / advertising but I'll get there eventually

cheers Adam / Bagpuss

[Trinity]

The nagging doubt that still remains after all these posts is:
does anyone pay business rates on their home set up, or has anyone actually enquired and got a favourable response. There's at least 4 home setups of varying sizes near me - none have asked and none do pay.