Underpinner problems

[framerswimbledon]

We bought an Imnes IM-4 a month or so back and are now havinhg problems with it. After some initial problems (and a replacement machine) it was working fine, but over the past couple of weeks it is taking longer and longer to actually fire (sometimes almost 1 min) and there is a lot of air escaping from the foot pedal. We've had a replacement pedal, but this is even worse. The pressure is showing between 6-8 bar, but the escasping air is now making the compressor work overtime! Anyone else had this problem?

Thanks,
Mark

[stcstc]

i would suggest talking to the supplier

if its new then under warranty should be sorted

[Gesso&Bole]

As stcstc says, speak to your supplier, I'm sure they will help.

If the air is leaking, have you checked that the pipe is cleanly cut at 90 degrees before it is pushed into the quick release fitting in the foot pedal?

Just a thought

[Graysalchemy]

Air is obviously leaking you say from the peddle but as Jim says have you checked your air line and fittings? Have you tried another airline on it? If it is the machine then leave well alone and ring the supplier. Is the 6-8 showing on a dial on the machine or on the compressor? It is obviously taking so long to pin because of the air pressure.

If you don't sort it then you are running the risk of damaging your compressor (not good if it is a bambi or equivalent they don't like extended use.)

[framerswimbledon]

Thanks everyone. We have been in touch with the supplier and they are due to come out again this week. All the pipes have been checked - it seems to be coming from the nuts on the underside of the pedla (which apparently are some sort of release value). Pressure is showing 6-8 on both the pressure guages on the machine itself. One guy at the suppliers has mentioned it might be because the compressor is too far away (about 10 ft to be precise), which doesn't really seem to make any sense, especially as the pressure is showing on the underpinner itself (and it was working for the first couple of weeks in exactly the same location!).

[Martin Harrold]

Our Technical Services Manager, Jack Siwinski, has had his head inside our demo model of this Inmes underpinner all day. Turns out it had the same issue. He's worked out that it was simple finger trouble in the factory. The lubricator has been supplied by the German component manufacturer open, and it should have been closed shut then opened 1/4 turn upon installation.

With it open wide, much too much air lube oil flowed into the machine causing various valves to jam. He's cleaned out the valves and pipes and all is well . He'll be visiting framerswimbledon tomorrow to do the same there. The Inmes QC department have been alerted. The lubricator should be adjusted so that it issues app 1 drop every 25 actions of the foot pedal. This is probably the same for Minigraf machines.

Lubrication of framing equipment is something that users should take care with. In many cases, too much air lube oil (which is not the same as compressor oil) gets into underpinners. And, of course, check your compressed air quality. Drain tanks at least weekly. If you are in an area of high rainfall, consider fitting a coalescent moisture filter in your system. Moisture in the system can turn to a yellowish gooey 'custard' causing valves to fail.

Stewart James-Dyke, our Technical Specialist, recommends that the pivot points of a Morso should be lubricated with grease rather than light oil.

[framerswimbledon]

The problem came from a combination of the oil mentioned by Martin above and moisture in the system. Tony and Jack from Lions spent nearly half a day taking the whole thing apart, cleaning it out and replacing some of our existing hosing, values, etc. Jack's knowledge is second to none and I'm really impressed with their dedication to finding a solution for us! Would have no hestitation recommending them.

[Nigel Nobody]

One guy at the suppliers has mentioned it might be because the compressor is too far away (about 10 ft to be precise), which doesn't really seem to make any sense,

That made me laugh! Perhaps the person was a book keeper, clerk or the janitor?

Perhaps they thought the compressed air wasn't contained in a pipe/hose and just had to make it's own way to the machine then locate an aperture to get into it?

[JohnMcafee]

Full marks to Lion for diagnosing the fault and making the necessary repairs.

Perhaps Martin could publish a step by step guide to fixing this flaw for the benefit of other owners who may encounter the same problem.

[Graysalchemy]

I am glad that Lion was able to sort the problem, however the comments about it being perhaps to far away from the compressor are little misguided and does make you wonder what that person thought of your level of intelligence.

This was a serious matter as you had obviously paid a lot of hard earned cash and quite rightly you should expect it to work straight away. I must say when ever I have bought an expensive piece of machinery I have always had it installed by an engineer even if it costs a few hundred quid more, that way you know it has been set up properly and you warranty is still intact.

However as I said top marks to Martin and his team for sorting it out.

Now it is working no excuse for not pinning 100 frames an hour

[Martin Harrold]

I’m pleased that Framerswimbledon is now up and running and thanks for the nice post about the service you’ve had.

We’ve all learnt a lot from this exchange. Most of the problems were caused by the quality of air coming from the compressor and the manner in which the air hose was organised. We’re very experienced in compressor and airline maintenance, as are many of our customers, but we’ve probably unreasonably assumed that all customers are. It’s definitely an issue as most of the underpinners we service have developed problems because of the air quality. So as John suggested, we’ll start working on an info sheet that will give advice and our guidance on good practice. When it’s ready we’ll post a link on the Forum.

All Inmes underpinners have a 3 year ‘Peace of Mind’ warranty, most other makes have a one year. Whichever make you buy and which distributor you buy it from, I’m sure you’ll be well looked after. However, problems caused by poor compressed air quality wouldn’t normally be covered by any warranty so it is best to make sure the air supply is tip-top in the first place.

There was a problem with the setting of the oil lube on the underpinner which was a minor assembly fault and didn’t help, but was easily rectified. QC at the Inmes factory have been reprimanded!

For those of you that will be coming to our Framers Event at Lion South on Sunday, or to the FATG Meet - Learn – Celebrate weekend near Bedford in June, our experienced service technicians will be at both and will be happy to chat about air supply questions.