The Framers Forum

Hi all,

I've been buying things again! Picked up these two framed eighteenth century Bartolozzi engravings today. Just wondering if anyone has a view on whether they are likely to be original frames, or period repro? There's a sticker inside from E Stacey Marks who I presume did the Verre Eglomise mounts, but I'm not sure if the frames are earlier. They have a dark brown bole with also pinky red highlights. Any views much appreciated! Apologies for the poor photos though.

Thanks,

Graham

Difficult to tell from the photographs, however the frames do not look that old to me.

The one on the left appears to be quite modern, but that could be a trick of the light.

I'm going to say that the frames are period antiques but not original to the prints. Is that a black cardboard mount surrounding the eglomise mounts?
I'm basing this on looking at the side wall of the frame on the right. The patina here looks a bit too convincing to be a replica. Also the gilding has a greenish cast that is rarely seen on any replica.

is there any cracking in the decoration or just on the corners
not just surface cracking but a sort of split in the decoration
as the linseed in the compo dries over time the cast shrink ever so slightly
most 18th century frames ( not all) were carved as compo decoration came onto the scene at the end of the 18th century (about 1790) so can be a rule of thumb for some guidance
have you got a close up pic and also one of the back of the frame?
Richard Christie will probably be able to help identify them- he's on the forum

If you call this sort of frame 'Late Victorian' you won't go far wrong.

The one on the right is interesting in that it is quite rough on the edge. This is a sign of quality frame
of some age. That one is maybe pre 1850.
They would gild the front and leave the sides with just a painted finish. To save gold I assume.

I can't really get a good idea from the photos, not even sure if they are carved or compo!, but I do think they look later than 18th C. If I had to guess based on the photos I would say late 19th C. As well as the cracks in the compo that Tim mentioned, on earlier frames you will also get fine cracks in the gesso, usually these are roughly perpendicular to the sight edge.