The Framers Forum

I've been getting a lot of Larson Juhl chop recently but I've noticed my FramR calculations are not matching my purchases.

Eg today:

217170548. Chop price £6.00/m+ VAT.

LJ calculates £7.80 + VAT = £9.36


FramR lists it as £7.20/m (so including VAT), but calculates £7.92.

I've checked my settings have VAT applied to materials I buy, which matches it showing as £7.20/m but I can't see why the discrepancy.

Would someone mind putting the above through their FramR and seeing if it matches?

Oops, I meant to say for a size 276 x 226.

Mine says it's £7.20/m and for that size is giving £7.23.
When you say "Larson calculates" do you mean in their invoce?

Yes, their invoice.

It is listed as £6.00 per meter (ex VAT) and their chop calculator gives me £7.80. The invoice adds VAT to £9.36.

But FramR gives me £7.92 at £7.20/m including the VAT (based on 1.10 meters needed)

I manually calculate 1.1m x £6.00 = £6.60. x 1.2 (VAT) = £7.92 so agree with FramR.

It's only a couple of pounds, but I'm not sure why the difference?

I've just tried a 300 x 300 on 526025167, also £6.00/m chop.

FramR gives me £9.73 inc Vat.

LJ calculator gives £9.00 + VAT.

I've just run a few random mouldings at different price points through and am getting the same. FramR inc Vat is (roughly) equivalent to LJ + VAT. Which on expensive mouldings is a fair bit!

Unless I'm reading LJ too simply, and there is a surcharge beyond the £X/m chop price? These are just chop, not adding the routing service.

I thought they rounded chop price up to nearest half metre but they’ve rounded your 1.1m up to 1.3m

Ah, if it rounds up that makes sense, thanks! And that follows through to the other examples - 1.35 rounded to 1.5m, and 1.54m to 1.8m

In which case though, can I get FramR to reflect that? Looking back at my invoices, I've been a few pounds out each time. That's before any mark-up which would cover it anyway, but I'd prefer it to be as accurate as possible.

Well here’s what I did

Framiac prices a chop job cheaper than a length job due to lack of wastage and labour (it’ll also price a chop and join job although no supplier does that, try that!)

So I imagined two customers collecting the same frame job at the sane time with one wondering why their cost is higher than the other guy.

I priced chop the same as length.

The only way I can think is to increase the markup slightly across the board.
I think Jo @Tudor Rose is the one to ask!

I noticed that Larson's chop price doesn't match with what they charge for chop (they add something else), so if FramR is using Larson's chop price, it'll never match.

As an example, this moulding is £6 per metre chop (which is the price FramR is using) but Larson's website calculates a 500x500 frame as £14.40 not £12. I questioned Larson about it a while ago and was told something like "chop costs more so we have to charge more". I get that, I just don't understand why they can't advertise the actual chop price. Surely That should show £7.20 chop price, not £6! And that's not them showing it inc VAT, the VAT is still added at checkout

I can only assume they are rounding up due to wastage etc on their chop prices, which does make sense. But to cover it, it does look like you will have to do some sort of a workaround.

JKX (John's) solution is a quick and easy way to do it!

Another easy remedy if you always buy chop from them - is to add a minus discount to your Larson Juhl moulding prices, which can then add a small percentage increase to the moulding to cover that additional cost. It's what we've done where we know that delivery charges will always increase moulding costs from certain companies. A small percentage increase across the board more than covers the annual cost. And yes, I know that we should think of that as a general expense for the business, but it does allow us to fine tune it and take some of the guesswork out!

To do that, go into your list of suppliers (via Stock), and pick the right one, then where there are the tick boxes to say you stock certain lines from them, add a minus number, say -5 in the discount box. That would then increase all their prices by 5% after you Save and restart the programme.

Thank you all, and JXK/Jo - both are really good options. I'm glad I'm not going mad. I was fixating on VAT settings.

I will be having a play around to see what works best. Seeing yesterday's undermount post, I've realised I have never charged for those so I am reviewing all my pricing/overhead costs.