Morso 'v' Charnwood

[dottad]

Hi Everyone, My name is Dot and I'm new to this forum. I found it in my quest to find the answer to a question.
I work full time and am a part time artist working in graphite. I have been mounting my own work and now want to progress to framing it too. I like the satisfaction of doing my own work. I am planning on getting this piece of equipment so that I can use it now and plan for when my hubby and I retire as a small cottage industry to earn those extra pennies that we will need.

Well, in looking at mitre guillotines, I have of course looked in ebay and at the Morso website and the UK dealers too, and then I came across the Charnwood mitre guillotine which when looked at is so near to being the same that it begs lots of questions: why is it cheaper, why do you get a 7 year guarantee with it yet only 5 years with a morso, and why do you get both extensions, plus top blade guard etc as standard with the Charnwood. I have contacted various companies etc in my quest for answers and although they have all been helpful, they do say their product is the best - whether that be Morso or Charnwood.

So what is the question!

Does anyone have working knowledge of Charnwood as well as Morso, and be able to give me their opinion as to the reliability of the Charnwood. I think that with all the stuff I have read about Morso, I can be rest assured that it more than does the business and will last a lifetime and some; but would the Charnwood do the same?

I have looked at secondhand morso's and even bid on a couple, but lost at the last minute - hey so its a lottery out there!!

Would love some help with this one please.

[John]

Hi Dot,

Welcome to the forum.

I have no experience with the Charnwood, but I'm guessing that there is little difference in reliability or function between it and the Morso.

I am surmising that because Charnwood are trying to make inroads into a market that is so much dominated by Morso, they have to try that bit harder by offering a better deal.

Either machine, I'm sure, will last a lifetime's use by a bespoke framer.

[Roboframer]

What John said

Plus - most framers have a Morso - other machines are based on it but will have differences.

If you have problems with a Morso you can solve them here; you'd have difficulty swapping problems with an owner of a 'copy' - although there will of course be some after-sales service, both from supplier and manufacturer.

[foxyframer]

Welcome Dot

Morso - the original and the best. A good servant. Had mine for over thirty five years from new and never a problem with it. So fully recommend you try to get a decent second-hand model with two sets of blades if possible. Good luck.

[absolute framing]

Hi,

I love my morso, and would not change it. i've had it for 4 years and bought it second hand. They are a reliable and sturdy machine, i would "invest" in one as it will not let you down

regards,

stephen

[georgeh]

hi Dot

I was in your position a year ago looking at various pieces of framing equipment.

The Guillotine i decided on was the Morso, based on the build quality and the fact that most the framers i spoke to at the time seemed to be using the Morso.

However as I am based in Malaysia I was only able to source the charnwood locally, the cost of shipping the Morso from the uk was prohibitive.

As the charnwood is manufactured in Taiwan, it was a lot cheaper to purchase here and I purchased one in February, after some haggling the supplier threw in a spare set of blades free!

I was very impressed with the build quality and after some training at the suppliers workshop I have been achieving good results.

Training in the use of these machines is in my opinion essential, although the process seems straightforward the machine must be set up properly and the cutting technique is important, not to mention the safety aspect of handling the very heavy and sharp blades.

Have you actually seen the machines demonstrated, FW Holroyd in Glasgow were very helpful, they had a morso and a cassese underpinner set up at their reception area and the guy who runs their chop service was very helpful in demonstrationg and offering advice.

To answer your specific questions i guess the cost difference is mainly due to the lower manufacturing costs in Taiwan, as i say the build quality of the Charnwood is good and looked after properly i imagine very reliable for a number of years.

Given the choice though if I was in uk i would opt for the Morso, although i am very satisfied with the Charnwood, the fact that the Morso seems to have been the market leader for a number of years and the brand loyalty it has amongst framers speaks for itself.

Hope this helps

George Hannah

[dottad]

Thanks to everyone who replied. Your feedback has been a great help to me.
George, thanks, yes I have been to FW Holroyd, they had an open day a couple of weeks ago and I went to see their Morso in action. The guy who they drafted in to do the demonstrations talked me through the machine and let me have a go. I was more than impressed. I may add, that I also had a go at one which I saw on ebay and went along to see. It was then that I realised that the one at FW Holroyd had had its peddle set too high and I had found it difficult to work, whereas the other one was set just fine and I was able to work it with ease - I'm only a little person and the one at FW Holroyd I had to jump on it to get it to move.

I have had feedback from Sam at Framers Corner today and the reply said that they used to be Morso agents but are now agents for Charnwood. They reckon that the Charnwood quality of machine is upto the standard of the Morso and that their blades are interchangeable with the Morso blades and also that they had their blades tested. The test showed that their blades were actually harder than the Morso blades and they have found that their blades last longer than the Morso ones. They also carry all spare parts for the Charnwood.

Oh dear, what a quandrie - still giving it lots of thought as its too much money to spend lightly.

[aivar]

It is strange, that nobody recommends Cassese CS-55M. I in the beginning career worked on MORSO, but 6 years on CASSESE. Also I consider, that it is the best guillotine in the World. It both more quickly, and is more convenient in work. Unfortunately, I sold by the gross MORSO, and repeatedly there were problems. Especially with a detail which is adjusted under height of a quarter of a moulding. For 6 years of trade CASSESE I do not know any problem with these machines.
At me in a workshop costsCS-55M and I recommend all only it

[Sam Cook]

Hi All

Have just been reading your comparison comments with interest!

John pretty much got it right with his comments on price difference - we know that Morso has a long established name after trading for over 80 years so we wanted to offer what we believe to be great value for our machine.

We know that Morso's are great machines and will last for years and we never dispute their quality, but we got a little frustrated with there being nothing else any good on offer on the market so thought we would produce our own. We are worlwide exporters as well as UK suppliers so knew there would be a large market for our machine.

I'm sure Mr Dyson would agree with us that just because a product is well established in the market it doesn't mean to say there isn't any room for some quality competition!

[dottad]

Hi to everyone,

Thank you for all your comments. This has opened up an interesting discussion. I always like to get as much information as I can about something I buy which costs quite a lot of money. The fact that this forum exists is great for people like me who are starting out in this industry and needs all the help they can get.

Can I say that I wonder if because Morso is such a well known brand name if it is the same as someone not buying a 'Skoda' but buying a Volkswagon, because it is a Skoda and not looking at the fact that maybe it is just as good as a Volkswagon but without the price tag.

I have been taking a keen interest in this topic and I think that although I agree that of course Morso is a great machine that I am sure that Charnwood will be just as good.
I think Sam has given an interesting slant on this and to be so sure of a product and be willing to argue about the quality of workmanship etc especially on an website which has a worldwide audience, tells me that it should be a good machine and therefore worth considering very seriously. To make claims and not be able to back them up would be not make business sense.

I think that I will be contacting Sam to ask a few more questions and then hopefully take the plunge soon.

Regards,

[georgeh]

hi Dot

As i said in my previous post the build quality of the charnwood is very good,it is also a very robust machine,i agree with Sam 100% when she says it is a quality product.
I'm sure you will not be disappointed whichever machine you choose,do make sure that you famililiarise yourself with the set up procedures of the machines i.e adjusting the rebate supports, fences, horizontal and vertical setting of the blades etc. and the lubrication points for maintenance.

one thing i would have found very useful would have been an instructional video on the set up and maintenance of the machine, luckily I have a very good local supplier who has 40 years experiance in framing, to give operating instructions and advice, but I had 2 hour flight to get there!

Good luck with your search.

George Hannah

[dottad]

Hi George,

Thank you for your knowledge on the Charnwood and good advice. I will be sure to ask about information of the set up of the machine when I get it.

I think the Charnwood will be the one that I go for and although you said you would have gone for a Morso if given the opportunity, I'm pleased that you are having good success with the Charnwood.

Thank you once again for your input and help.

I can see that an instructional video would be of great help, especially if like yourself and me you are not based close to where the machine comes from. Maybe Charnwood could think of this in the future - maybe one to ask Sam?

[dottad]

Hi Everyone,

Just taken delivery of my new mitre guillotine - so excited, can't wait to get started.

Thanks again for your input. As you have guessed, I took the road of the majority and went for Morso.

Dot

[foxyframer]

Hi Dot

Congratulations on the arrival of your Morso; many years of unbridled excitement. Good choice and recommended by most of us. Watch fingers especially when removing and changing blades, they are heavy and not worth mishandling.

Good luck

[Keith Hewitt]

I always remember my dear friend Agner Pedersen, (past MD of Danlist/Morso) once telling me he could easily tell a prospect from user just by shaking hands with them.

The prospects still had all their fingers intact, the customers had bits missing!

So it is true! The blades are sharp, even when they are BLUNT!!


Keith Hewitt
(Life is like a pack of mount board - you never know what to expect - until you open it!!)

[dottad]

Hi Guys,

Thank you for your words of wisdom. I have a great respect for those blades, so fingers crossed(while I still have them) that I will keep them well away from those pesky blades. I need my fingers too much to take chances.

I have originally got this to complement my artist streak, ie to frame the commissions I do for people. I have had so many people asking if I would be able to frame the drawings too, so that was what brought this on.

I hope you will all be able to help me when I get stuck! I have a full time job at the moment and plan to build up the framing side of things over a period of time. I plan to do a course at some point and learn to do all the things that you guys do, but at the moment it is an expensive hobby that hopefully will turn into something more in time.

I have a commission at the moment which is for someones grandchild, I have already done their first one and they are looking for the same frame as the first one, but I can't see it in any of the catalogues that I have, would anyone be able to help if I posted a picture of it?

Dot

[John]

A picture of the moulding would be a great aid to identification.

Let me know if you need any help posting the picture Dot.

[dottad]

Hi John,

Thank you. Yes, uploading pics is a problem, but here is link to my yahoo photos page where if you click on picture 'mya' hopefully you will get a good look at moulding. The framer whoever they were has maybe done it themselves, I just don't know but it does look like a 'wash' over plain wood!

http://photos.yahoo.com/dottytad

Dot

[John]

Dot's frame

[markw]

try Ashworth & Thompson - 54811 - 54813 - 44813. difficult to know the size from pic - 54*** is 32mm 44*** is 22mm - check catalogue for colour. http://www.ashworthandthompson.co.uk/co ... =61&page=2