Double Mitre Saw

[GeoSpectrum]

I have ordered chop a few times in recent weeks and have been very impressed with the quality of the cuts done on a double mitre saw. There is nothing particularly wrong with the cuts i make on my Morso but the usual problems happen from time to time such as chipping of the finish, the back of the moulding not quite cutting cleanly, whiskers etc. All of these are part of a Morso users lot but do these types of issues go away when using a double mitre saw?

Any other advantages/disadvantages of using a double mitre saw over a Morso?(apart from the expense of course! the cheapest I've seen is about £5,700 + vat)

Thanks

[Framerpicture]

I have a Cassese 969 and I'd say the advantages are:
Excellent cut - No chipping or break out
Size of cut -up to 6 1/4" wide moulding (depending on model)
Speed - Depending on the model they can be very quick,but are able to keep the same pace all day.
Ease of Use- All my staff can use the saw to a good standard- This wasn't the case with Morso's.
Smart Stop- An automatic digital stop.This is so useful for bespoke work

Disadvantages:
Space- Much larger footprint than a morso
Noise- Not that noisy but much louder than a morso!
Dust- You need good extraction-
Servicing/Repair Cost - A problem if you need an engineer as they're always at least a day away

I bought my saw secondhand at an auction.It was only 2 years old and I got it for a fraction of the price of a new one. Included was an extraction system I could never have afforded!

Which saw have you been looking at?

[Gesso&Bole]

One other major disadvantage, is that even with good dust extraction, the saw really needs to be in a different room to the finishing, assembly and mountcutting. Most British framers simply don't have enough space.

[GeoSpectrum]

Framerpicture, thanks for your reply. I saw the PRISMA-CE Brevetti Mitre Saw on the Wessex stand at the Spring Fair. So far this is the only one I have had a look at.

[Graysalchemy]

As a 939 user I would agree with what Will and Jim say.

Dust extraction can be a problem and you will need to spend money on a decent industrial ectractor. The other thing you will need is a decent compressor, even my 200l Hydrovane 502 is constantly running (which they are made for). Finally something else which hasn't been mentioned even though they are made as single phase 240v, they are better and more longer lasting in the three phase 415V so are hydrovane compressors.

Having said all of that I picked mine up second hand for about £3000 and paid £1000 for the compressor (reconditioned) and got an adequate dust extractor for about £500 (not the best). But most of the machines second hand will be 3 phase.

Go on , you know you want one

It is only a matter of time before you cross over to the darkside

Alistair

[Framiac]

I had a Brevetti double mitre saw. The fully automatic one, I can't remember the series. It was quite a good saw, although they do need to be fitted with kanefusa blades to cut really well.

You will definately get a better, more consistent cut than using a guilotine and they are much easier to use day in day out. Dust is an issue although you can keep it to a minimum especially with a good dust extractor. The Brevetti has dust extraction outlets on both sides of the machine and if you use both of them you will reduce the amount of dust floating around.

If the machine is in the same room in which you do all your framing good house keeping is also a must to keep the dust down. Ours was set up in the same room and this seemd to work fine. As Graysalchemy said you will also need a decent compressor, the automatic double mitre saws certainly suck the air.

Mark

[Framerpicture]

I saw the PRISMA-CE Brevetti Mitre Saw on the Wessex stand at the Spring Fair. So far this is the only one I have had a look at.

Its true automatic saws use a deal of air .With this saw you pull the blades over by hand so I wouldn't have thought it has such a high air requirement- if any at all?

Alistair mentioned the power supply- Most saws are three phase - I was lucky enough to have this in the building already but if you haven't a phase converter would probably be a cheaper option.

The other advantage I forgot was that saws are much safer than a morso!

[Graysalchemy]

The other advantage I forgot was that saws are much safer than a morso!

But if you do get bitten you will get mauled at least a morso is a surgical cut

Joking aside it is impossible on cassese saws for the operator to get any fingers near a blade as both hands are needed for operation so hands are on buttons away from the saw.

[Abacus]

I use a brevetti prisma Ce. Great bit of kit. No air needed. And a 13 amp supply is all it needs. I've hooked it up to a small extractor and to be honest it's not quite up to the job, but it's in a different room to assembly so not really a problem.

Feel free to come to west Yorkshire for an extended demo in the real world.

[misterdiy]

I use a single mitre saw currently alongside my Morso and this is OK. The Cassesse 969 is definitely the RR of double mitre saws but they are a big investment that need loads of mitre cuts to make the investment pay.

The biggest problem I found in trying to get a second hand one was the logistics of getting it from the auction house to the workshop, off loaded and installed. As they weigh around three quarters of a tonne I cant stick it in the back of the motor, or a hire van. I would be interested to know how Framerpicture got his back from the auction in Cornwall so if I do see one then i could be prepared.

[prospero]

I think I read in the Lion cat something about having a forklift available to take delivery of the beast....

[Framerpicture]

I purchased the saw on the Isle of Wight- I hired a luton van with a tail lift and moved it with a pallet truck- It was all realitively straightforward for two people apart from having to take the door out to get it in the workshop when we got it back!

[Graysalchemy]

I bought mine from Neil (framingengineer) and he delivered it with a luton van with a tail lift, on a pallet. Once off the van we used a pallet truck. They are not that hard to move.

My casesse 3099 underpinner was more of a problem it was sent on a courier with out a taillift assuming I had a forklift. Two of us slid it off then hand balled across the yard.

They are a big investment but less of an investment than a CMC and yes probably wouldn't suit most bespoke framers but then a few years ago people said that about CMC's. If you are making a fair number of frames a day then they are definately worth it. The quality of cut is also far superior, as long as the blades are sharp and the clamps etc adjusted to the moulding. However they do also benefit being used in tandem with a good pneumatic underpinner for good tight joints.

Feel the force MisterDIY the darkside is beckoning you, you know you want one .

[misterdiy]

I DO, I DO. Mrs D isn't so keen though and of course there is the slight problem of keeping it going full belt. I don't really turn enough frames out each week to warrant the expense.... but I am working on her

[Graysalchemy]

Get yourself an imaginary bad back, which renders it impossible for you to use a morso .

May also get you out of gardening and other household chores.

Seriously though If you are only making a few frames a day it isn't worth it but if you are doing runs of frames even mixed sizes then it most certainly is worth it. I can now cut and joint about 40+ frames an hour, mind numbingly boring and noisy (a pair of ear defenders a must) though, I wouldn't want to be stood doing that all day.

[Graysalchemy]

I see Uk Framing Supplies Ltd 01530 836444 have a refurbished 939 for sale.

Every 939 deserves a good home,

Go one you know you want to.