The Framers Forum

Hi Guys,

Great forum, it has been very helpful to me since my first post when I sought advice on getting my initial kit,

Over the past year I have been using finished moulding or using basic stains on bare wood with wax to finish,
I have never actually painted any bare wood as yet and have some cheap and cheerful flat pine moulding i wish to turn black

Although probably a very basic technique, I thought I would ask some advice first before I go and ruin it all,

So what steps should I take, prepping, type of paint and finishing? the end result doesn't need to be super smooth just basic really

Thanks in advance

Dan

Pine can be difficult to paint. It varies a lot and there are lots of different species. If it's nice smooth stuff and no knots, it's just a case of applying coats until you build up the coverage you need. Big knots will show no matter how much you sand it. Also they can bleed sap which can eventually show a brown crusty mark. Sealing knots with a coat of shellac is the usual cure. In fact on fresh cut stuff it's not a bad idea to shellac the whole surface.

Black artist's acrylic is as good as anything. Finish off with a wax polish. Black acrylic gesso is also good.

Thanks prospero!

Do you know if this would be good for the job :
http://www.diy.com/nav/decor/paint/prep ... d=12028302

Thanks again

Never tried it, but that should do the job. Ordinary shellac (French polish) is OK. And you can use it for other things.

That's not a bad price!

When I've a black frame to do, I use ash as I like the grain of the ash that shows through the paint. I use Plaka paints and paint directly onto the wood. It dries to a very matt finish but looks great with a couple of coats of dark wax (such as Liberon tudor oak) and some yellow duster action

Why not just stain it black, wax it and buff to give a nice sheen?

David beat me to it by a couple of minutes and with photos!

I normally cut my lengths a bit oversize paint/stain/wax and then trim to size and join.

cheers guys,

that does look a nice finish!, will have to get me some of that paint.

The pine moulding in question has a lot of knots and the liberon stains (water based) i have only take to certain parts of the grain and don't take to other parts
so i'm guessing priming/filling then painting/ waxing is the way forwards

will test it out

David, what moulding is that? I like using ash too. I find it nice to work with.

Can I ask a Plaka question?

I've been using black plaka on gesso and have found that it will quickly buff to a lovely deep inky black using just a yellow duster. I follow up with some Renaissance wax, but to be honest this is just because I think it could use the extra protection, it doesn't add much to the sheen.

My query is I just started a new pot of Plaka and find that this one refuses to buff up like before. I guess I can wax it and buff but I'm curious to know why it's behaving differently. Any ideas?

Here's what I'm after

ALSO...
has anyone had any luck using matt varnish on unbuffed plaka to retain the velvet matt quality it gives?

GeoSpectrum wrote:David, what moulding is that? I like using ash too. I find it nice to work with.

A40 Rose & Hollis

I too would be interested to hear of a good matt varnish. I often like the finish of F&B paints (estate emulsion) but wouln't be keen to leave them like that for fear of being too easily scuffed. I end up waxing everything that's been painted for protection... any finish you like so long as it's gloss!!

Dead matt finishes are a pain frankly. I was once brought a hf frame that had a matt black panel in the middle. It had a little mark on it which the customer had tried to rub out. He only succeeded in making a shiny spot. I suggested repainting it with a satin finish. No, it must be matt. So I got a couple of spray cans and painted the whole panel. Looked perfect - until you touched it. One light touch left a very noticeable mark. Sprayed it again. And again. I must have used about four cans of spray (at about 6 quid each). In the end I did mange to get the thing back together without touching the black. I told the customer on no account must anything touch the panel. Fortunately the panel was fairly well inset. No the ideal situation though.....

Not all waxes are the same, many are specifically formulation for a particular purpose. Renaissance wax is produced for conservation uses and is not specifically intended to produce a gloss finish.

In fact there are much better waxes and more cost effective waxes if the principle requirement is to produce a gloss finish. I think that you will find that the Black Bison range of waxes will produce a far better gloss finish and at a lower price.

For a really good gloss finish, I rub the wax on, rub it off, heat it with a hot air gun to fully evapourate the solvent in the wax, let it cool fully and then buff to a high gloss. It's really quick and easy to do!

Dead matt oil based paints tend to be more durable than dead matt water based paints. Also they don't tend to show every fingermark quite so much as waterbased dead matt finishes.

I have had good results using dead matt varnishes as an alternative to resorting to dead matt paints and in this case good quality dead matt waterbased varnishes can be a lot better than dead matt waterbased paints. As always you get what you pay for, so buy a good one!

Hey Mark, any suggestions for a good quality matt varnish?

Do you want the list? There are so many really good ones to choose from!

Here we go:

Dead matte oil paints and dead matte oil varnishes.

Farrow & ball, Brewers, and Rose of Jerico, plus a good many others. Normal dead matte oils have to be ordered specially some suppliers don't like doing this for you. Oil based paints take longer to dry, but can be mixed with Japan driers, or turbene.

Matte acrylic media.

More recently I have been using Vallejo acrylic fluid matte medium as a varnish because it is very conenient to use and the price is good. I nearly always buy my matte acrylic varnishes and mediums from Jacksons Art Supplies, this is largely for my own convenience, due to a lack of convenient well stocked suppliers close by. Their phone number is 0844 499 8430.

There are a number of similar companies as well, which are probably just as good. This just happens to be the one I tend to use.

Thanks Mark